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  1. #1
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    High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    Hi All

    Yesterday I picked up a very sad 1977 Beta saloon with a 2L engine.

    There is a LOOONG list of items to tackle. But first items are

    Sort out oil leak/s
    Sort out high idle and running very rich.



    I am very certain apart from the oil leak on the cam housing. Will need to replace all those gaskets. I have a vacuum leak.

    I just wanted to do a sanity check on previous people messing with car.

    In image above.

    It looks like my vehicle has the standard WEBER 34 DATR carb

    My understanding is that

    1) Primary idle jet ( this currently read 45)
    2) Primary emultion tube and main jet ( this currently reads 170)
    3) secondary emultion tube and jet ( this currently read 240)
    4) secondary idle jet? ( this currently reads 80)

    I just wanted to do a sanity check since i am worried someone swapped things.

    5) I am very confused by that pipe, It looks like a vacuum hose? But it connects to a small T next to the crank case breather on air filter.

    When I close this pipe while idling idle drops A LOT.

    Before I remove intake manifold and cam gear for new gaskets I just wanted to make sure I understand.

    also follow up question.

    The red wire running to what i understand is the Fuel cutoff solenoid. should this be energized with ignition on even if motor is not running?

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    Legendary Lancista SubGothius's Avatar
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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    According to the Haynes manual, jetting for a 2000 engine 34 DATR should be:
    • Primary Idle Jet: 50
    • Primary Main Jet: 120
    • Primary Main Air: 170
    • Primary Main Emulsion: F.30
    • Secondary Idle Jet: 80
    • Secondary Main Jet: 150
    • Secondary Main Air: 240
    • Secondary Main Emulsion: F.30


    From what you described of that hose #5, it diverts crankcase vapors directly to the intake stream at the base of the carb, when the vacuum from that port is strong enough; otherwise at low port vacuum, vapors flow from the big hose into the air box at the top of the carb.

    The red wire to the fuel cutoff solenoid should be energized whenever the ignition key is on, regardless of whether the engine is running.
    Best regards,
    -Tye (1979 Lancia Beta Zagato spider)

    "In theory there's no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is."
    -Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut

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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    Thanks for your help.

    It still confuses me how that pipe no 5 does not mess with idle mixture then? I suppose they simply factored it in with design.

    The idle mixture screw has half a turn between bottoming out and killing engine car idling at 2000RPM.

    But I am most likely chasing my tail and there must be a big vacuum leak somewhere.


    Removed carb last night and will be removing intake manifold and at least front cam box because it has a bad oil leak. ( brake booster hose was very loose fitting)

    Between replacing intake manifold gaskets ,new brake booster pipe , carb gasket and giving carb a good clean sorting oil leaks i'll revisit this in the next week or so when everything is together. most probably problem will be solved

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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    Hi. How’s the car progressing? Been a sedan owner for 33 years and am curious about your car. If I can help in any way let me know. I see you’re in South Africa. That engine shot looks very different than mine. I have a 1978 1800. Good luck. Jim

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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    Hi

    thanks for your interest.

    ours is a 2L

    it is a very much process currently happening.

    So Far we have:

    1) removed and cleaned intake manifold ( 3 of the 6 studs was WAY to short and barely finger tight) lots of red silicone.
    we have a new gasket.
    2) inlet cam box gasket was leaking, we have replaced that gasket.
    3) exhaust cambox gasket was also leaking so we also removed that and replaced gasket.
    4) exhaust manifold had only 1 bolt and 1 nut holding it on (facepalm)

    On the front of engine I ordered (pardon if my naming convension is wrong.

    new gaskets for fuel pump
    new round gasket for the crank case breather (collector?)
    new elbow for connecting that crank case breather to the port right next to it.
    new distributor gasket

    On the right hand side of engine

    new cam belt
    new cam belt tensioner bearing
    2 new belts driving power steering pump , waterpump and alternator

    All of the above are in process of getting put back.


    One problem I ran into.

    The Engine in the vehicle has NO TDC markings.

    It has no marking on cam belt cover.
    There is also no markings on block.

    I did see a 0 5 10 marking on a PORT in the gearbox but there is NO markings that i can see through that port on the flywheel.

    So far I have used a dial indicator to get TDC and made markings. The current installed cam belt was for CERTAIN 1 to 2 teeth late on the crank pulley according to my TDC markings.



    I am leaving lots of standard service items off and also have the radiator out and had it pressure tested etc.

    hopefully over the weekend I can start assembly again.

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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    The vehicle was kind of standing for the last 2 years. It was part of inventory of a place that used it for film shoots.

    I managed to get hold of the elderly lady who owned it most of its life.

    She and her husband was owners of multiple lancias , flaminias etc she told me.


    this beta was the fancy model with auto leveling headlights etc.

    But currently it has a VERY 2 hour yellow paint job with overspray everywhere and a completely busted sunroof.

    And BAD rust around both front jacking points.


    I am not certain where me and my brother are going with it. But currently the plans is to get it to not leak any oil , run well , do brakes etc etc etc.

    Do the mechanical stuff first.

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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    Wow!! You're really going to town on the car and that's nice to see. They're not the easiest cars to wrench on as I can attest to that. Tight engine compartment. Not even sure Lancia imported the 2000 to the US in 1977 but not positive about that.

    With regards to the timing marks that is odd. Are you positive about that? Should be marks/holes punched into both cam cogs with an indicator mounted there to point to them when at TDC. Also on the crank pulley is a mark that aligns with several marks on the cam cover. Ancillary drive pulley also has an alignment hole that lines up with the tensioner spring bolt when at TDC. Hopefully you and your brother are taking pictures to document the progress. I would love to see some pictures posted of the car as I'm sure others would as well. Keep up the good work. Jim
    1978 Lancia Beta Sedan.

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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmyspirits View Post
    Not even sure Lancia imported the 2000 to the US in 1977 but not positive about that.
    1979 was the first year for the 2000 engine in the US.

    With regards to the timing marks that is odd. Are you positive about that? Should be marks/holes punched into both cam cogs with an indicator mounted there to point to them when at TDC. Also on the crank pulley is a mark that aligns with several marks on the cam cover. Ancillary drive pulley also has an alignment hole that lines up with the tensioner spring bolt when at TDC.
    I think he's referring to crank timing marks in particular being absent, which could happen with an early car if the timing belt cover is missing or was replaced with a later version, or with a later car if the toothed indicator bracket went missing somehow. The bellhousing window to the flywheel may still suffice, though there could be grime on the flywheel obscuring the mark; a shot of brake cleaner in there may help reveal it.

    Presumably you've seen my T-belt change procedure linked from the homepage here, but just in case not:
    http://www.lancisti.net/forum/conten...procedure-tips
    Best regards,
    -Tye (1979 Lancia Beta Zagato spider)

    "In theory there's no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is."
    -Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut

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    Re: High IDLE 1977 Beta saloon 2000

    Hey thanks for all that Tye. I did see your timing belt change procedure. I’ll be doing mine again as I’ve not done it in 30 years lol. Cars been sitting for many of those.
    1978 Lancia Beta Sedan.

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