Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 41
  1. #11
    Experienced Lancista tangmonster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Cape town ,South Africa
    Age
    38
    Posts
    93
    Downloads
    22
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    at 6000rpm the distributor rotor is turning at 3000rpm

    For a dwell of 60 degrees ( degrees of rotation that coil is energized) the points only has 3.33ms to charge coil for each spark

    Question is with hot points what is the resistance of those points contact? It sure as heck won't be the sub 100mohms that modern Mosfet technology can provide.

    Is 3.3ms enough to charge coil up completely taking it's inductance and points resistance into account?

    Also How good is that spring on the points? does it even close quick enough to provide 3.3ms??

    In below graph points are not able to fully charge coil:





    at 1000rpm the distributor rotor is turning at 500rpm
    at 60 degree dwell that is the points gets close to 20ms to charge coil. That is a lot of wasted energy heating up coil and points.


    I am still running points. But I am quite interested to measure using oscilloscope the charging curves for interest.

    There are many other variables.

    even a simple system that has lower wasted energy limiting charge time and sub 100milli ohm resistance that will provide quicker coil charge time would be technically superior.

    How much it improves top end power I am not certain. But it should at very least help with cold running and "clean up" top end and provide increase in driveability.

  2. #12
    Master Lancista Racer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Kristiansund
    Age
    61
    Posts
    243
    Downloads
    41
    Uploads
    1

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fulvia-hf View Post
    When I developed the engine of my 1200Hf I found out that the stock ignition, having worked perfectly well on the stock engine, proved to be the Achilles heel on the new engine.
    The new engine with hairy cams, 42 Solexes and over 11:1 CR needed a substantially different advance curve. The 123 Tune provided all that and even if I do not like the look of this thing it proved to be one of the best modifications of all. It removed a stubborn flat spot and raised low down torque, lessened pinking and works as a rev limiter (cut out a 8000rpm). I believe max power on the dyno was the same as the stock ignition (point replaced with Pertronics) but the car became much more rideable. Oh, I have fitted the 123tune with programmable vacuum advance. Fulvia's never had this but carefully programmed this vacuum advance improves mileage somewhat.
    Cheers,

    William

    William, PM sent

    Tor

  3. #13
    Active Lancista Radman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    North Yorkshire
    Age
    57
    Posts
    37
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Hi,
    could I take the opportunity to use this thread to ask a beginners question about the 123 electonic ignition settings? I am in the throes of installing one. There are several possible settings from A-E or possibly even F which are all specified for identical engine numbers and MARELLI distributors etc in the instruction leaflet that came with mine. You have to set it up with one of these selected. Are these all potentially useable for my engine simply offering slightly different advance curves? I'm not sure which one I should be using for the newly rebuilt engine in my Fulviasport 1.3 1972.

    Jem

  4. #14
    Legendary Lancista Marnix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    1,416
    Downloads
    67
    Uploads
    8

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Quote Originally Posted by Radman View Post
    There are several possible settings from A-E or possibly even F
    Settings go from 0 up to F (it is an hexadecimal switch)

    Quote Originally Posted by Radman View Post
    which are all specified for identical engine numbers and MARELLI distributors etc in the instruction leaflet that came with mine. You have to set it up with one of these selected. Are these all potentially useable for my engine simply offering slightly different advance curves? I'm not sure which one I should be using for the newly rebuilt engine in my Fulviasport 1.3 1972.
    At the last page of the leaflet (at least mine) it specifies the right setting in function of engine type. Most Fulvia engines had the Marelli 105C distributor (excluding 1600 engines of course), so you got to take the setting for that if you got what I think should be a 818.303 engine for a Zagato 1,3 from 1972. Setting according to my table is at switch position "2" (two)

    The other settings are for either other distributors (e.g. the very early Fulvias with the 105B distributor, or the the 1600 engine distributor). Still further settings are not for the Fulvia but for Flavia distributors.
    Lancia Fulvia 2C 1964
    Lancia Fulvia Coupe Rallye 1,3 1968
    Porsche 924 1979
    Alfa Romeo 33 1.4IE 1993

  5. #15
    Legendary Lancista Marnix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    1,416
    Downloads
    67
    Uploads
    8

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    With the possible warning that my 123 is almost 10 years old, and they may have changed things in between. If you can somehow pass on the complete leaflet of your 123, I can probably show you what to set.
    Lancia Fulvia 2C 1964
    Lancia Fulvia Coupe Rallye 1,3 1968
    Porsche 924 1979
    Alfa Romeo 33 1.4IE 1993

  6. #16
    Active Lancista Radman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    North Yorkshire
    Age
    57
    Posts
    37
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Thanks for the reply Marnix,
    I will upload a photo of the table from the instruction leaflet that came with mine. You're right there are multiple settings from 1-9 in addition to A-F but for many the relevant distributor and engine data are to me identical hence my confusion.
    Will upload later today.

    Jem

  7. #17
    Active Lancista Radman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    North Yorkshire
    Age
    57
    Posts
    37
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Here is the appendix supplied with mine with the table for Lancia.
    Setting 2 is for a Marelli 105C distributor, I will have a look at mine and see if that is what I have in which case this should be the one then. Whereabouts on the distributor is the type marked?
    The A-F options seem to be duplicates which was confusing me.
    Thanks for the assistance,

    Jem
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DSC_0260.JPG  

  8. #18
    Master Lancista bernt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Braunschweig
    Posts
    144
    Downloads
    39
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Huib also has the curves and codes listed on his site:
    http://www.viva-lancia.com/specials/ignition/index.htm

    Note the same curve, but different fixed advance for the different engine types using the S 105 C distributor!

  9. #19
    Legendary Lancista lancialulu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Colchester
    Posts
    2,377
    Downloads
    58
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Quote Originally Posted by Radman View Post
    Setting 2 is for a Marelli 105C distributor, I will have a look at mine and see if that is what I have in which case this should be the one then. Whereabouts on the distributor is the type marked?
    Jem
    Its a little cast circle on the stem of the dizzy.

  10. #20
    Legendary Lancista Marnix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    1,416
    Downloads
    67
    Uploads
    8

    Re: Electronic Ignition?

    Best check the engine number. If my guess is right, should be 818.303. That number is stamped on the rear part of the crankcase, at the top of the location where the starter motor is fixed in the crankcase. If it is a 303, it is definitely a S105C. As Tim said, the type of distributor is stamped on the stem (may be difficult to see if the distributor is installed). About all Fulvia engines, except the 818.000 (the normale), some early 818.100 (the 2C) and the 1600 engine (818.540) were equipped with the S105C, so there is not much risk at confusion. Set the switch in the distributor to position 2.

    Huib's leaflet is indeed maybe more clear.

    You also have to take into account the static advance. For a 303 engine, should be set at 8 degrees. Set by rotating the distributor at the correct rotation angle before firmly fixing it with the bolt.

    PS: numbering starts at 0, not 1 (it is a hexadecimal switch, goes from 0 to F, like the hexadecimal digits of computers). The higher numbers are really spare numbers, in case the same distributor would be programmed with additional curves for other engines (as may be the case when used for other car makes were the distributor is also used).
    Lancia Fulvia 2C 1964
    Lancia Fulvia Coupe Rallye 1,3 1968
    Porsche 924 1979
    Alfa Romeo 33 1.4IE 1993

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •