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Thread: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

  1. #31
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by lancialulu View Post
    Did you fit a new thermostat? Difficult job and could be the source of your problem. Not at all easy to assess in situ and generally if they have been in a long time it could have failed but you will need to destroy the middle and cut it out as will be corroded in its mount on the top hose water rail.
    Hi Tim,

    Yes the thermostat is new (bought from a Fulvia parts specialist in Italy), I suspect it might have something to do with the problem. It did pas the boiling water test before it when in, but still it might not be 100% working. I do have my eyes on the very nice looking thermostat from classiclancia.com although its a bit pricey (although if it works better, well worth the extra cost).

    So far on my list to do over the winter with the cooling issues (Thankfully our winters are very long in Sweden ):
    1. Check the meters under the dashboard. All electrical meter show a bit weird readings so I'll check for grounding issues and such. (Combined with Brians suggestion of getting an IR thermometer to double check he readings)
    2. Change all the water hoses to silcone hoses. I already bought a set from classicsiliconehoses.com that I just need to fit. (I guess I will also replace the straight hoses to the heater as well a the heater valve diaphragm, as a precaution)

    Possibly also:
    3. I am not happy with the loosing of water. I would like to try a stiffer valve radiator cap. I had a poor series 2 cap on the car, a search in my inventory came up with a NOS S2 and an old but good looking S1, The S2 had a 0,5 bar rating and the S1 a 0,35 rating. I think I have seen a S1 type (newly made with a much higher pressure, like 0,7-0,9 bar. (I see that people list S1 and S2 as not compatible, what is he difference? Apart from the aesthetics, the only difference I can see is the extra gasket on the top of the S2s)

    If there still is problems also:
    4. Change thermostat again.
    5. Rebuild radiator core.
    Karl

    1964 Flaminia Touring Convertible 3C 2.8
    1965 Fulvia Berlina (Appendix K project)
    1969 Fulvia 1,6 HF
    1999 Ypsilon
    2003 Thesis 3,2
    2011 Delta 1,8 Di T-Jet

  2. #32
    Master Lancista Taddraughn's Avatar
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Check the water pump too for the overheating issue. That was the source of my overheating. Mine had a huge hole corroded on the intake side of the pump (see my build thread; first couple pages)

  3. #33
    Legendary Lancista lancialulu's Avatar
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    The thermostat has to have a tiny c1mm hole on the edge of opening disc.

    Maybe your rad is blocked.

    All Lancias let off excess water till they find the correct level. This is generally c1cm above the top of the core when cold. Is this what is happening?

    Tim

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    Active Lancista Akonaut's Avatar
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Karl,

    checking the radiator is a good idea. But not only the core may be a problem. My Sport 1.3S was also loosing water but it was not clear where. When the radiator was out, I found out that the support of the lower water box was corroded.



    After dismantling of the u-profil and removing the tin-solder I found a hidden hole.



    The hole was closed and a new bottom of the radiator made. That solved the problem.



    BTW, what does classiclancia ask for the thermostat?
    Flaminia GT 3C, Flaminia Convertibile 3C, Flaminia Coupé-project-, Flavia Convertibile 1.8, Fulvia Sport 1.3S, A112 Abarth 70HP, Mercedes Benz Unimog U406

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    Legendary Lancista fay66's Avatar
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by lancialulu View Post
    The thermostat has to have a tiny c1mm hole on the edge of opening disc.

    Maybe your rad is blocked.

    All Lancias let off excess water till they find the correct level. This is generally c1cm above the top of the core when cold. Is this what is happening?

    Tim
    I had a lot of problems at one time with overheating that I couldn't work out, eventually turned out to be neither of the new thermostats I bought had the small hole Tim is referring to, it was such a problem because every time I put a new thermostat in place, my 2c boiled, take it out and it was fine for 2 years I ran without a thermostat at all, instead in the winter I used a rad muff (Bra?).I suddenly realised that neither of them had the small bleed hole.
    I screwed the thermostat in place, marked where the hole needed to be at the top, removed the thermostat, drilled a 1/16th of an inch hole in the correct place, refitted thermostat, promptly went on the Fulvia Knights Rallye to Turin for the Fulvia 50th Anniversary, a distance all told of 2000 miles ,end of problems.
    Brian

  6. #36
    Legendary Lancista bmarler's Avatar
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by Akonaut View Post
    Karl,

    checking the radiator is a good idea. But not only the core may be a problem. My Sport 1.3S was also loosing water but it was not clear where. When the radiator was out, I found out that the support of the lower water box was corroded.



    After dismantling of the u-profil and removing the tin-solder I found a hidden hole.



    The hole was closed and a new bottom of the radiator made. That solved the problem.



    BTW, what does classiclancia ask for the thermostat?
    nice work as usual hubert, thats a startling amount of corrosion in comparison to the rest of the car. that part has a tough life though, water from all directions.
    bmarler/
    1967 fulvia sport zagato
    1961 appia vignale convert.

  7. #37
    Legendary Lancista bmarler's Avatar
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by fay66 View Post
    I had a lot of problems at one time with overheating that I couldn't work out, eventually turned out to be neither of the new thermostats I bought had the small hole Tim is referring to, it was such a problem because every time I put a new thermostat in place, my 2c boiled, take it out and it was fine for 2 years I ran without a thermostat at all, instead in the winter I used a rad muff (Bra?).I suddenly realised that neither of them had the small bleed hole.
    I screwed the thermostat in place, marked where the hole needed to be at the top, removed the thermostat, drilled a 1/16th of an inch hole in the correct place, refitted thermostat, promptly went on the Fulvia Knights Rallye to Turin for the Fulvia 50th Anniversary, a distance all told of 2000 miles ,end of problems.
    Brian
    yes brian, that weep hole is very important not only for venting the air from the system, but it allows a small amount of coolant through if the thermostat is stuck closed. i suspect you couldn't properly get the air out and warm coolant never reached the thermostat. i have other cars that can be a real bear to vent, lots of hose squeezing and whatnot.
    bmarler/
    1967 fulvia sport zagato
    1961 appia vignale convert.

  8. #38
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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by lancialulu View Post
    The thermostat has to have a tiny c1mm hole on the edge of opening disc.

    Maybe your rad is blocked.

    All Lancias let off excess water till they find the correct level. This is generally c1cm above the top of the core when cold. Is this what is happening?

    Tim
    Quote Originally Posted by fay66 View Post
    I had a lot of problems at one time with overheating that I couldn't work out, eventually turned out to be neither of the new thermostats I bought had the small hole Tim is referring to, it was such a problem because every time I put a new thermostat in place, my 2c boiled, take it out and it was fine for 2 years I ran without a thermostat at all, instead in the winter I used a rad muff (Bra?).I suddenly realised that neither of them had the small bleed hole.
    I screwed the thermostat in place, marked where the hole needed to be at the top, removed the thermostat, drilled a 1/16th of an inch hole in the correct place, refitted thermostat, promptly went on the Fulvia Knights Rallye to Turin for the Fulvia 50th Anniversary, a distance all told of 2000 miles ,end of problems.
    Brian
    Yes, the new thermostat did not have a bleeder hole in it. I will put that on my to do list, to remove it and drill a small hole in it. As per Brians idea I will first mark what is the top of the thermostat to make sure the hole is as high as possible.

    After the first run the water was below the radiator core, after that run I switched radiator cap and the water has stayed above the core, but I have also checked and refilled (over filled...) it constantly.
    Karl

    1964 Flaminia Touring Convertible 3C 2.8
    1965 Fulvia Berlina (Appendix K project)
    1969 Fulvia 1,6 HF
    1999 Ypsilon
    2003 Thesis 3,2
    2011 Delta 1,8 Di T-Jet

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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by Akonaut View Post
    Karl,

    checking the radiator is a good idea. But not only the core may be a problem. My Sport 1.3S was also loosing water but it was not clear where. When the radiator was out, I found out that the support of the lower water box was corroded.



    After dismantling of the u-profil and removing the tin-solder I found a hidden hole.



    The hole was closed and a new bottom of the radiator made. That solved the problem.



    BTW, what does classiclancia ask for the thermostat?
    Ouch, that was a nasty hidden hole...
    Classiclancia wanted something like €400 for thermostat. I thought it was a bit steep for a thermostat, on the other hand if that would be the solution to the problem, it would be worth it.
    Karl

    1964 Flaminia Touring Convertible 3C 2.8
    1965 Fulvia Berlina (Appendix K project)
    1969 Fulvia 1,6 HF
    1999 Ypsilon
    2003 Thesis 3,2
    2011 Delta 1,8 Di T-Jet

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    Re: Putting a 1,6 HF back on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by bmarler View Post
    yes brian, that weep hole is very important not only for venting the air from the system, but it allows a small amount of coolant through if the thermostat is stuck closed. i suspect you couldn't properly get the air out and warm coolant never reached the thermostat. i have other cars that can be a real bear to vent, lots of hose squeezing and whatnot.
    I had a situation where my S2 would fluctuate between 70 and 80 degrees and at one time reaching 90 plus before the thermostat opened. I thought that the position of the thermostat was in a slightly dead area as the water was going to the pump when warming up via the small hose and not really reaching the thermostat bulb. A small hole in the thermostat resulted in a steady temperature at a gauge reading of 70.

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