for sale,76 lancia scorpion

[dburdick]

selling my 76 scorpion.Overheats all the time. Please don't ask me if I tried this or if I tried that. I am heart broken to sell this car. Here in america, it is illigal to build a car that handels well. Ever since high school, I wanted a mid engine sports car with 50/50 weight distrubition, but my country would rather build tanks for rappers than sports cars. I thought this was the car of my dreams, but no matter what I tried, it overheats. I have speed hut gauges in it. Including the GPS speedo. I have 15 inch rotas on it. I installed a 2lt '79 fiat spider engine with Vick's 8mm dome pistons and their oversize stainless steel valves and converted the ignition to the '79 electronic ignition from the fiat spider. I am running the original 1800 head. Please forgive my spelling.

[KeppelmanJ]

That's a touching, sad post. I invested a lot of time and elbow grease in a couple of Scorpions too and finally gave up, but over over-heating? That shouldn't be so hard to figure out and fix. Do you know a go to guy in SoCal who will consider the problem with/for you? A Scorp guru? You still sound like you love the car...

[HF Stinger]

If he were in SoCal I think he'd have all the help in the world, but it's South Carolina right?

Which car is this, have you posted pics of it anywhere?

[dburdick]

That's a touching, sad post. I invested a lot of time and elbow grease in a couple of Scorpions too and finally gave up, but over over-heating? That shouldn't be so hard to figure out and fix. Do you know a go to guy in SoCal who will consider the problem with/for you? A Scorp guru? You still sound like you love the car...sadly, I live in south carolina, not southern california. Where I live, if you don't dive a four wheel drive pickup,pick your nose and are married to your first cousin, there isn't much hope for you here. God help me.

[dburdick]

If he were in SoCal I think he'd have all the help in the world, but it's South Carolina right?

Which car is this, have you posted pics of it anywhere?Theonly pics I currently have online can be found at Allison automotives web site. He has my car in his ad for Rota wheels.

[1,6 HF]

That is very sad. Even down in pick-up truck land, though, there must be someone who could make a thicker-core aluminum radiator, and I know you said not to, but did you tear down the engine to see if it's some odd blockage in a water gallery? (Sorry...) Because it sure doesn't sound like you want to let it go.

[davidb]

Well mine ran hot back when. Had a rad shop flush it, still wasn't right.
I got a X 1/9 rad from Matt [salvage, rated 9 of 10]. My God that "new"
rad musta weighed half as much as the old one! Meaning the old one
was full of crap. Stupid rad shop, Jesus Christ. It's been fine since.

[dburdick]

That is very sad. Even down in pick-up truck land, though, there must be someone who could make a thicker-core aluminum radiator, and I know you said not to, but did you tear down the engine to see if it's some odd blockage in a water gallery? (Sorry...) Because it sure doesn't sound like you want to let it go.Sigh... Ok, here goes... I guess with car nuts like us, we can't get away with simply saying "I've tried everything". I bought the car in Febuary, and it was a cold month. It was a VERY stock car then, right down to the original rims. The heater controls were(And still are) frozen, can't make the push buttons move, but I enjoyed the car anyway. The stock instruments indicated that the temp was always running low, like 160F. Anyway, around May, I was driving on the interstate when it started overheating. I stopped and bought a gal of antifreeze. I cracked opened the airbleed on the rad and, with the car running, added coolant to the resivoir. No good. I did this a number of times untill something in or around the heatercore blew! I had a steam bath inside! Thank God for Haggerty and their free towing! I decided now would be a good time to do some upgrades. I got 15x7 Rotas with Handcook 195/55/15, a complete set of Speedhut custom Gauges with the GPS speedo(love that thing by the way!), and got a 2lt fiat engine from a 79 spider. The block and the original 1800 head from the Lancia went to the machine shop. The shop informed me that my #4 cylinder wall was to rough to overbore, so they sleaved it. They boiled out the block and the head, decked the block(not sure how much),pressure checked the head, installed my Vick's autosport stainless steel oversize valves (three angle valve job) and installed my Vicks 8mm dome/84.4 pistons.They polished and measured the crank and said it was fine,run standard bearings,which I did.The engine itself set me back 500. The machine work was around 500.The parts? Can't remember and don't want to.Anyway, I finally get all of this installed, burb the cooling system(I was told the radiator had been professionally flushed just before buying the car)and warmed it to normal op temp,shut her down, and retorqued the head the next day.She has been overheating eversince. I tried redoing the cooling pluming with a new threeport thermostat,then a in the head thermostat,no good. I was using the original Lancia waterpump,with the 16mm impeller. I'm at my wits end. Oh yeah, my compression is 230psi per cylinder,and evenrunning 93 octane, I have to retard the timing so far any preformance gains I should have realized are null and void! Should have stuck with stock pistons and a 2lt head. Live and learn.

[Allen Lofland]

Well it is obvious you have given up, sorry , how much are you asking :)?
By the way, with those pistons and that head you are over the CR allowed with street gas, Some one will need to redo that rig with a 2 liter head.
Anyway, Sorry for your troubles, they are fixable, yo have not finished yet but it seems you are finished so lets talk price.

[Scott H]

I was told the radiator had been professionally flushed just before buying the car

There is a saying we use where I work, "How can you speak of something which you have not seen".

With all of the radiator issues so well documented I would hardly take someone's opinion that the radiator is OK. By the way, define "flush". That can mean anything from draining the coolant to connecting some whiz-bang pressure flusher. For $250 you can get your radiator re-cored with a more modern design (and more efficient) core.

Not meaning to be harsh while you are so frustrated, but in light of you scrapping your project and dream, I would argue that you have not done everything.

This one? Nice car.

4741

4742

Good Luck,
Scott

[dburdick]

There is a saying we use where I work, "How can you speak of something which you have not seen".

With all of the radiator issues so well documented I would hardly take someone's opinion that the radiator is OK. By the way, define "flush". That can mean anything from draining the coolant to connecting some whiz-bang pressure flusher. For $250 you can get your radiator re-cored with a more modern design (and more efficient) core.

Not meaning to be harsh while you are so frustrated, but in light of you scrapping your project and dream, I would argue that you have not done everything.

This one? Nice car.

4741

4742

Good Luck,
ScottYes, that's the one. That's my grand son in the background. I think I will go the last mile here and pull the radiator. I'll take it to a shop I know of in town and explain the symptoms I've been having. I thought it was odd that the PO volunteered the info about having the rad serviced, as I didn't ask him about that or anything regarding overheating.

[dburdick]

Well it is obvious you have given up, sorry , how much are you asking :)?
By the way, with those pistons and that head you are over the CR allowed with street gas, Some one will need to redo that rig with a 2 liter head.
Anyway, Sorry for your troubles, they are fixable, yo have not finished yet but it seems you are finished so lets talk price.Yep, that CR is of no use. If having the rad serviced works, maybe then I can keep the car, in which case I have a 2lt head ready to go. I'll keep you posted on the progress, or lack thereof. I will have the rad out and in the shop's hands tomorrow afternoon.

[dburdick]

Well mine ran hot back when. Had a rad shop flush it, still wasn't right.
I got a X 1/9 rad from Matt [salvage, rated 9 of 10]. My God that "new"
rad musta weighed half as much as the old one! Meaning the old one
was full of crap. Stupid rad shop, Jesus Christ. It's been fine since. Are you saying an x1/9 rad is the same as a scorp? I have a '79 x1/9 stored away! Will its rad fit my scorp?

[davidb]

Yes I am representing [if not warrenting] that an X 1/9 radiator WILL
fit. Depending upon the year of the X 1/9. Throughout the production
run of X 1/9s [many years] there were countless modifications. Call
MW-Bayless & speak to Matt or Thomas. If you wish to try a new rad.
Your feed & return lines may be rusted closed or constricted. Then
there's the "famous" thermostat orientation w/Scorp's. A re-core
will be 3X more than a salvage, rated X 1/9 rad from MW-Bayless.

[dburdick]

Yes I am representing [if not warrenting] that an X 1/9 radiator WILL
fit. Depending upon the year of the X 1/9. Throughout the production
run of X 1/9s [many years] there were countless modifications. Call
MW-Bayless & speak to Matt or Thomas. If you wish to try a new rad.
Your feed & return lines may be rusted closed or constricted. Then
there's the "famous" thermostat orientation w/Scorp's. A re-core
will be 3X more than a salvage, rated X 1/9 rad from MW-Bayless.Thanks! Thats good to know. I'll try my 79 x1/9 rad and see if that helps.

[davidb]

A rad swap will @ least eliminate that as a culprit. It goes w/o saying
your X 1/9 rad should be flushed/tested before install. It takes ages
to purge the air from these coolant systems. A bleeder @ the high
point in the engine compt. [hose] assists. Good luck & success.

[Scott H]

You do have a nice car and it's great to see you back at it!!

This tool will cost a little bit of $$ ($84) but it is well worth it my opinion. I have one and can fill my Scorpion's coolant in 3-5 minutes. I run it and confirm the radiator does not have any bubbles and I am good to go. Total time is about 15 minutes from start to completely purged.
http://www.amazon.com/UView-550500-AirLift-Economy-Refiller/dp/B000O3IGI6/ref=sr_1_2?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1313075911&sr=1-2

4750
All automakers use vacuum to fill the cooling systems on teh assembly lines and they can do it all in about 60 seconds. Those are a little more sophisticated but this tool operates on the same philosophy. I am a huge fan and have never had an air pocket concern after using this.

Scott

[Andrew S]

DO NOT GIVE UP!!!!!!!! It's against the law...
Seriously, you have a beautiful car there and if you only have one major fault with it you must not give up on it!!! You'll hate yourself for allowing a fault to get the better of you when you hear of the new owner enjoying the gorgeous Italian sports car he just bought and fixed...

You know I'm right. Keep at it. Remember why you bought it in the first place. That hasn't changed, you just have something to fix, that's all.

Good luck!

Andrew.

[DJ]

I've been spending too much time away from the forum. My life appears to have become too complicated and I'll be making some changes soon.

But in the mean time, Doug, I'm only 140 miles away from you in Charlotte. I have a good radiator in my storage unit if you're interested in giving it a try.

Yes, the X1/9 radiator is the same as the Scorpion. Some will tell you there are differences but the part numbers are the same.

If you've never had yours disassembled, rodded out, and re-soldered, I can essentially guarantee (at least 99%) that this is your problem. These rads will flush and flow nicely even when they are grossly clogged up. Been there with more than one car.

But if you insist on selling it, I'll give you a couple hundred bucks for it. ;-) I like the color. Don't sell it to Allen because he'd paint it in British Racing Green or something.

We should get together. I'll show you that these cars can run nice and cool with the stock radiator, even on a hot day.

[dburdick]

OK! OK! everyone! I'll go to the rad shop with the old radaitor first and simply tell the guy to recore the thing. I've got more money tied up in this car than my last two spiders combined! Sorry Allen, blame the rest of the group for talking me into trying one last thing before giving up!:cheers:

[77_scorp]

Everyone here has the right idea. Don't let her go! You got this, all you need to do is breathe a little.
I've been here with a few cars that were indeed not worth the trouble, but the Scorp is a great car
that is a piece of history at this point and if you look a NADA guides... looking like a very appreciable car!
Lucky for us, it's such a simple car that you don't need to see a specialist for most problems like the one you speak of
and I truly hope your problem is resolved via the new radiator / re-core job.

I've notice that my 77 has a coolant smell at some very hot points but does not leak, nor does the heater.
Here' in mountainous Northern California, I do all kinds of brutal hill climbs, performance drives and sport
driving in wildcat canyon hills, and I have never had a coolant leak or overheat. Trust me when I say
it's not the car's fault or a specific Lancia issue.

[dburdick]

Thanks DJ, its support like this we need. Kind of like a 12 step program for Italian car junkies! Yep, we should get together and talk shop sometime. Allen would paint it BRG? Really?

[DJ]

OK! OK! everyone! I'll go to the rad shop with the old radaitor first and simply tell the guy to recore the thing. I've got more money tied up in this car than my last two spiders combined! Sorry Allen, blame the rest of the group for talking me into trying one last thing before giving up!:cheers:

I'd just tell him to disassemble and inspect first before jumping straight to recoring. Normally they can be rodded out and resoldered and don't need a new core if the fins aren't eaten away. That's a LOT cheaper. Contrary to what some may tell you, this radiator is very dense and does a great job of cooling when renewed. It's the same radiator that's used in the Strato's so that tells you a good bit about the design and capability. I've had more than one radiator shop tell me how nice a radiator design it is.

And my spare is yours for testing first if you want to try it.

[DJ]

Thanks DJ, its support like this we need. Kind of like a 12 step program for Italian car junkies! Yep, we should get together and talk shop sometime. Allen would paint it BRG? Really?

Maybe not BRG but something totally inappropriate for sure.:rolleyes:

(Allen and I have a "thing" going on with color.) :red face:

[ecohen2]

I have a radiator that is in great shape I can send if you want... If it works, send me something for it, otherwise send it back..