Uprated Coupe/Spider Suspension Springs

[markwast]

Hi everyone
Just a quicky from Beta Boyz.
We are just organising a short run of lowered/up rate springs for the Beta coupe. Up rated by 25% and lowered by 30mm.

Anyone interested email betaboyz@msn.com .
we have a deadline of 23rd Jan but could be extented if enough interest.

Cheers for now Mark.

Ps if you order a set of springs we are also offering a set of polybushes at £65 (discount £15).

[Pope1]

Mark, is this a one-off production run or are you likely to be repeating this at some stage in the future?

[markwast]

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your question.
Answer is I am not sure, it depends on people wanting them. We had a lot of talk on Beta Boyz and the usual happens, we get things sorted out, then nothing. I am struggling to get the min six sets for that short run.
The cost for a set of four springs is only GB£124.00 but the shipping is the killer for anyone outside the UK.
The same has happened with the LHD washer bottle, sold seven!

It is starting to p*** us off here.

But on the good side, we have a few new parts coming early 2005, all being well. Ill try to add a seperate posting about these.

All the best Mark.

[Pope1]

Thanks Mark. I think that's a pretty fair price and I would definitely be snapping up a set if I lived in the UK. As you said, shiping is an issue if you're outside the UK but the bigger problem for me is the state of the roads over here. I've went the short spring route before with my Punto GT and ended up taking the springs off again some time later.

Sorry to hear that you having difficulty making the numbers. The other products I've had from BetaBoyz have been first class. The washer bottle was not inexpensive for the reasons that you mentioned but for me it was worth it. My garage is littered with the remains of old Lancia washer bottles in varying stages of disintegration. It was nice to get something that doesn't lose 50% of the water poured into it and looks like it's built to last.

Just fitted the front suspension bushes and found the job a piece of cake. Everything went together with a degree of precision that is uncommon and augers well. Haven't been able to drive the car yet and still have the rear ones to sort out.

[SubGothius]

Mark, I'm sorry to hear how dicey US sales propositions have been for you'n'the Boyz; I suspect the dodgy economy here lately, along with unfavorable rates for exchange and shipping, have been the major, perhaps only, obstacles for US Lancisti wanting to buy from you. I've wanted polybushes for a while now, eagerly awaiting the new transaxle mount, but I just haven't been able to spare the cash for them.

Have you considered working with a US agent to distribute your goods here? I.e., you'd just ship to the agent a large bulk order, which may economize overseas shipping, and they would handle all US sales and shipping themselves; you could even direct US buyers wishing to buy from your site over to the US agent's site. I'd think the ideal candidate here would be one of the established/recognized parts outlets, namely International Auto Parts (http://International-Auto.com/), or Chris Obert & Co. (http://FIATplus.com/), or Bruce's Parts Bin (http://fiatparts.com/) or Vick Autosports (http://VickAuto.com/). My personal recommendation goes for Vick, as they were founded and operate in similar spirit to the Boyz -- quality goods, reasonable prices (sufficient to recoup costs, reinvest, and keep the operation running), expert advice, by aficionados, for aficionados -- and I've been satisfied using their site to shop for items and doing business with them before.

[Pope1]

That exchange rate thing is a real killer at the moment as I pointed out to Mark in a private e-mail. So much so, I'm planning to back to the UK for a few months this year to try and source some work/projects there because, given a 4:1 rate between the Barbados dollar and the pound, it makes no sense earning Barbados dollars if you have the opportunity to do otherwise.

[Fingers]

Know exactly what you mean, but the lifestyle here outways the financial gains of living in the UK.

[chrisc]

Found this yesterday for you coupe/spyder owners

http://www.topgear.co.uk/acatalog/Jamex_Lancia.php

[badboyboogzy]

mark i would be happy to be an agent for the springs and bushes here in oz as isell parts anyway and im moving into suspension and bodykits and all sorts of preformance upgrades if you are interested let me know i know i would love a set i even have the money i just cant afford the freight from england aswell if you send say ten or 20 sets freight is cheaper i could sell them befor they even got here email me at bettabetabitz@yahoo.com with the pics prices and styles ie which is which (hpe coupe) and the statistics of them all and i will do some selling but i would need to have them sent here fairly quickly after sale as most woont wait for long
renay

[Fingers]

I had my original springs reset by a local spring maker one inch lower than standard about 7-8 years ago. I never really looked at them until recently and realised that I only really had about one inch of suspension travel left at the front as the bump stops are now obviously one inch closer to the lower spring platform. This explains the constant thumping when I drive over any bumps larger than a pencil. I initially thought I had the shocks set a little too stiff. Anyway, I've cut just less than an inch off the bump stops now and it rides beautifully, just something to be aware of if you fit the lowered springs.

[Pope1]

Well it depends what you do. If you simply cut down standard springs then you will have issues with the amount of suspension travel. It's better to get uprated springs (preferably progressive ones). As they are stiffer, the car is less likely to hit the bump stops but obviously the ride will suffer somewhat as well.

[Fingers]

Yeah, I've never thought cutting the existing springs was a good idea, you lose that nice tidy coil at the end to allow it to sit cleanly in the shock or upper end. I think that as I've had mine reset that the temper has actually changed aswell, they do seem a lot stiffer. I had a search around for custom made progressive springs when I bought the car in 95 but no one made them at the time, I had previously had some Jamex progressive springs in my Audi GT Coupe, they were very nice, and firmed up a really soft ride.

I've got the GC 3A cam and 45DCOE all in and jetted correctly now, has taken a while to get a fuel pump problem fixed(new girlfriend, taking up my spare time) but I finally have it on the road, what a rocket, I can't believe the difference, I'm in love all over again, with the VX that is.

Just in time for the Latins by the Lakes car run in Nov, A local run for Italian cars only around the Southern Alps and lake regions of the South Island, if you've seen Lord of the Rings you'll know it, bit of a cliche I know. I'll take lots of pics and post them after the run.

[Skufy]

I would be interested in a set of springs and I know that there are a couple of owners on the French forum interested. How far off are the 6 min sets?

[Neil]

I must be missing the point here guys. Why do you want lower springs?
Whenever I come out of the supermarket my heart misses a beat as it seems that the car has been stolen by some scumbag (with good taste lol), due to the low roof height making the car hard to spot amonst all the modern rubbish (that I can't afford!).
The ride is really firm and there is hardly any roll on the corners. Any more severe and the old VX would be too uncomfortable for my ageing bones!

[Skufy]

I've got a firm one(well 4 off) and a soft one, preference is the firm. Lower ride is not a priority. As for the roof height, gets me as well. Had a look at the jamex springs, a lot cheaper..........

[SubGothius]

As to why one would want to lower a Beta, purely aesthetic motivations aside, some might prefer different springs tuned to reduce front-end lift/rear-end squat during abrupt acceleration, particularly with hi-po engine mods -- no fun stomping on the gas and losing steering traction... 8O Moreover, I seem to recall that US cars had slightly taller springs, particularly in front, in order to raise the headlights to legal height for Federalization with the DOT (same reason the Scorpion got popups to raise the headlights by a mere inch or so). If this is indeed the case, I find it amusing that I'm the only US poster in this thread so far... :roll: :lol:

[Pope1]

I must be missing the point here guys. Why do you want lower springs?
Whenever I come out of the supermarket my heart misses a beat as it seems that the car has been stolen by some scumbag (with good taste lol), due to the low roof height making the car hard to spot amonst all the modern rubbish (that I can't afford!).
The ride is really firm and there is hardly any roll on the corners. Any more severe and the old VX would be too uncomfortable for my ageing bones!

Ten years ago I used to think that the ride in my VX was firm but after sampling some modern cars I've found it to be reasonably compliant by modern standards with an excellent ride/handling compromise. I agree there is little roll on cornering. Reasons for lowering? Partly looks and hopefully to try and reduce some front end lift on acceleration. However, what concerns me is whether lowering will actually make the handling worse.

[Will]

As to why one would want to lower a Beta, purely aesthetic motivations aside, some might prefer different springs tuned to reduce front-end lift/rear-end squat during abrupt acceleration, particularly with hi-po engine mods --

Lowered springs bring the center of gravity lower. Without getting into a more technical discussion involving concepts like roll centers, let's just say that lowering the car generally keeps tire and suspension loadings more even, allows the car to get more traction and tighter corner, and has some lesser related benefits like reducing loading of the sway bar, etc.

Because of the length of wheelbase vs. track, and the relative difference between cornering acceleration and straight line acceleration, you'll find lowered springs don't make much difference in lift/dive (front/back) direction, neither does the puny Beta engine torque. You MIGHT notice it in braking except for most people lowering the car, they will also be increasing the spring rate.

But you should notice a definite plus in the cornering department. even if your call rolls the same amount (stock spring rate on lowered springs) you will still get some advantage, although from a strictly performance standpoint, lower AND stiffer is better.

I don't remember- but doesn't the Coupe have thos plastic spring perch bushes? If so, and you cut your stock springs, you NEED to re-bend/flatten them to fit the bushes. Hammer, anvil spur and welding torch should do it.

[Pope1]

I've heard that lower AND stiffer is indeed better until one lowers so much that the wishbone goes past the horizontal position.

[Neil]

Jamex springs on ebay ..... only 2 though ...... so only half ruin a good set up! :lol:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Lancia-Beta-Coupe-Lowering-Springs-120119_W0QQitemZ8003716818QQcategoryZ40192QQrdZ1QQ cmdZViewItem

[alfadoc]

Cheers all,
I'm a newbie here, but an oldtimer with Italian cars. When I worked for International Auto Parts, I designed performance springs for both the Beta and the 124. The Beta springs were about 18% stiffer in front, and about 22% stiffer in the rear. They would lower the car to slightly lower than Euro ride height. We sold an initial run of 10 sets (I think) fairly quickly. The reorder sat around for years. This was in 1994. Then they were discontinued.

When Vick began selling performance springs for the 124, he basically took my design and modified it a little. He had the opportunity to do the Beta springs as well (and probably has a bigger Lancia customer base than IAP at this point) and declined to do so.

Unfortunately, I don't think IAP or Vick are likely to jump at the opportunity to sell Beta performance springs these days. There just aren't enough buyers. Pity too; The IAP springs and a set of Konis would make a Beta coupe handle like nobody's business. I took my '81 Coupe to an Alfa track day at Summit Point back then, and surprised A LOT of Alfa owners. They all ignored me until after I came in from my first session. Then they all came by wanting to know what was under the hood, and especially how I could brake so much deeper into the corners!

[alfadoc]

Jamex springs on ebay ..... only 2 though ...... so only half ruin a good set up! :lol:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Lancia-Beta-Coupe-Lowering-Springs-120119_W0QQitemZ8003716818QQcategoryZ40192QQrdZ1QQ cmdZViewItem

I believe this is actually a set of four. Look at the photo on Ebay, it looks like one front and one rear. See also:
http://www.gbkperformance.co.uk/gbk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=89_178

How are the Jamex springs? I have no experience with them.

[Will]

Saluti Joel;

Many of us will remember your pic along with the anchracite Milano with the "Alfadoc" plates gracing the pages of the IAP catalog- especially since IAP thinks that catalog is a weekly, I think there are people that don't even own a car that get one.
Seriously, my fiancee gets it and she's never ordered anything, and now I see there's an International Autosport catalog or ad in whatever rag the airlines stick in the seat pockets, last month I forgot whether I was reading the IAP catalog or Skymall.

Personally, and money being no object, I'd opt for Penskes or a good DA gas shock, maybe Tein or Ledas, with a smaller diameter "modern" coilover. Sure, that's a lot more money than springs, but gives a lot more options to the setup.

I love the way the Beta handles, with the single caveat that it does a really crappy job of getting any kind of power to the ground. It's too light in the nose, and tries to just fill the passenger compartment with smoke instead of getting off the line. Unless it's a stock Beta, of course, then there's no call for traction ;)