shock's

[kev1_3s]

I've been trying to select shock's for the car and I cant decide which ones to go for, I'm not sure that I need koni's so I was thinking on decarbons doe's anybody here have any preferences?

[riczag]

Back in the 70s, I fitted a set of spax gas adjustable shocks to my 1.3S2 and they performed very well. The rear shocks were a direct replacement. The front shocks required some modification to the bush to fit properly. As I recall, the supplied bush/rubbers was a little small and I prefered the Lancia bush/rubbers which I had to modify in order to retain them.

I would have no hesitation in recommending them. I am not sure whether they still make them but found the following ad;

http://www.spax-suspension.co.uk/_c33657_33665_7726_7738~3~100.htm

They were very easy to adjust in situ between soft and firm, whereas some adjustable shocks have to be removed to adjust their settings.

[riczag]

If you are interested in the Spax, I have found a cheaper supplier.

http://www.dcperformance.co.uk/uprated/spax-adjustable-front-dampers/lancia/fulvia.html

Probably a little time spent searching on the internet would yield an even lower price.

[Rick]

Try these guys in the UK. These are exactly the same product sold on the continent for 3 to 4 times the price. Delphi bought the rights to make DeCarbon shocks and these are the real deal. I recommend them after just restoring my suspension. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260629820706&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260629820706&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT) PS The price is for a PAIR. If you buy them, install them with the strap intact and tighten the bolts with the car laden with driver. Remove the strap as the last step.

[johnsimister]

I would avoid Spax. They seem to have had a rethink in recent years, involving the notion that a 'performance' damper should be stiff and firm even in the softest setting. I had modern gas-filled Spax in the rear of the Lotus Elan I owned until a year ago, and they were dreadful. They chopped the ride to pieces. If I pressed down on the tail, I could count several seconds before the suspension rose back up, so stiff was the rebound damping. I replaced them with Konis which were much better.

De Carbons are better again. They are more compliant over small bumps, and they cope better with sudden depressions such as drains and potholes, but their control of bigger, low-velocity movements is also very good. This combination is exactly what you want. Gaz work well on my Saab 96 but I'm not sure if there's a Fulvia fitment. My current HF has De Carbons, the previous one had Konis. The current one is better.

John

[dr_danger]

Thumbs up for De Carbons too, far superior to anything I have had on the car for road use.

[lancialulu]

As John S knows I dont quite agree with him on Spax. I had the old model on the front of my HF set at 3 clicks off soft and found them compliant but, crucially, critically damped. I only changed them for later spax model as my MOT man said he would fail it next time due to misting of shock oil out of the top - I guess they were at least 10 years old. Anyway, ordered up a new set (care needs to be taken as the model number on an earlier catalogue is wrong as the fully extended length is too long...). These new versions with Krypton gas (sounds super to me..) had twice the adjustment range. So I started at 8 clicks off soft and drove the car for a few hundred miles. It was too hard with the front of the car skipping around all over the place. I dropped this to 6 off soft and found it just like the old shocks so have left it at that. I would be interested in any other settings fulvisti may have on Spax...

But to answer Kev's question I am catholic on matters of shocks as all my cars have deCarbon's on the rear, my HF as I said has Spax, and my Sport has Koni (one click up from basic setting) and my 1.3 Coupe has original deCarbons on the front. I like all of them but out of preference due to being able to adjust while on the car without any tools Spax is my favorite if I had to choose and the price was reasonable (all shocks can be bought at low or high price - I have bought the Delphi ones on ebay and am very pleased with them ....).

Hope that helps

Tim

[1,6 HF]

I'm with John on this. I acquired my HF with red Konis and with mediocre 70-series tires. I now run OEM Corte e Cosso (under license from DeCarbon) and Michelin XAS. And as far as I'm concerned, both changes made more improvement than rebuilding the entire front end. In between the Konis and the Corte e Cosso, I tried softer conventional shocks with dismal results--spongy ride and wallowing handling. The Konis had just the opposite problem; even at their softest setting, the front and especially the rear hopped around on anything but very smooth roads (and with California's decades-deferred road maintenance, we have no very smooth roads anymore).

So at the risk of lapsing into broken record mode (for those of you old enough to remember records...), I'll say yet again that you can never go wrong sticking with the factory spec. IMO, there's a very good reason that Lancia specified DeCarbon shocks for the Fulvia (and XAS for the 1,6HF) as original equipment. The ride is dramatically smoother and the handling is far better than with the Konis, as the tires now stay well planted, even on our typical lousy road surfaces.

[riczag]

As noted, mine were gas shocks and I fitted them front and rear. I was very happy with the handling. I don't recognise the handling characteristics noted by John. I always had my spax on a reasonably firm setting and the car was not too jiggly/skittish. When I pushed down on the suspension (which was reasonably firm), as soon as I lifted off, the car would immediately begin to recover its normal ride height position. There certainly was not a 2 or more second delay.
I am not sure that experience with a Lotus Elan is a valuable comparison (assuming that John is referring to the original Elan not the front wheel drive version). My Dad had one of these and it is a very light car. I can inagine that a stiff shock absorber could easily be too stiff for such a car and no doubt the original fitment used by Lotus was the best compromise for that car.
Of course, the original shocks on the Fulvia are very good. Most contemporary reviews on the car commented upon ride quality and suggested that this was about as good as it gets in a small car. Accordingly, unless one is contemplating setting up the car for competition, I am not sure why anyone would wish to substitute the original fitment. I guess that I am with Ed on that point.

[lancialulu]

To go a little bit further, with my orig 1.3 (decarbons) - the very best imporvement as per Ed was to fit new XAS's. The car was transformed! The give in the sidewall is all part of the setup - so other tyres with stiffer walls will behave differently.

Obviously we are not talking about pattern shocks here such as Monroes etc.....

Tim

PS Part of my evaluation was adjusting the shocks off the car in a v crude static test and comparing to stanard shocks I have as spares. The Spax it has to be said went v stiff (esp on rebound) after a few clicks. Half way I could not move it manually!

[kev1_3s]

thanks for all the reply's guy's think I've made up my mind on the decarbons!

[Fulvia]

So, do I understand correctly the Delphi's are the same as the DeCarbons at well under 50% cost???
If true does anyone have a direct link (eBay ones are sold) to a dealer?

[1,6 HF]

DeCarbon is both a manufacturer and (by default) a type of shock that they pioneered--a monotube with a piston & valve that runs in conventional fluid, with a second, floating piston separating the fluid-filled chamber from a gas-filled chamber above it. DeCarbon has for a long time licensed the basic technology to a number of other manufacturers. In period, one of the best known of these licensees was Corte e Cosso, who produced OEM shocks for Lancia (and proudly advertised their association with the works Fulvia rally cars). Apparently, Delphi is now making DeCarbon-type shocks under license.

[Fulvia]

So, is there an American source?
Shipping for this stuff is prohibitive compared to the price of the parts...

[1,6 HF]

So, is there an American source?
Shipping for this stuff is prohibitive compared to the price of the parts...

Effectively, there's no US source that I know of. Anyone who's supplying these in the US is paying to have them shipped and undoubtedly passing the shipping costs along to any purchaser here. And while they might be getting a better shipping rate for bulk, you'll have to add the domestic shipping costs from any US supplier.

Shocks are always relatively heavy items, so shipping's always an issue. But, frankly, I'd say it's not really bad news that the shipping seems high by comparison to the price. What it really means is that the shocks themselves are pretty reasonable. After all, I don't suppose you'd rather pay three times as much for the shocks in order to make the shipping seem comparatively cheaper...

[Fulvia]

Effectively, there's no US source that I know of.After all, I don't suppose you'd rather pay three times as much for the shocks in order to make the shipping seem comparatively cheaper...
Seriously good point, and compared to spares I have to buy for some of my collector cars ($50 oil filter elements, don't even ask about suspension parts!) it is really cheap in total. Just thought I would ask in case there was a source I was not aware of...
Dave

[scarmike]

Does anyone have a current well priced source for the De Carbon shocks? Is there a model # specific to the Fulvia Coupe? thanks!

[lancialulu]

Check Ebay UK (try googling) as there is a guy selling decarbons for fulvias at really good prices. I have had a couple of sets in past couple of years. If you can find an old ebay advt then contact him direct.

Tim

[scarmike]

No luck with Ebay, only found one guy who used to sell them but he says he no longer stocks.

[fay66]

Just spotted these on www.viva-Lancia.com (http://www.viva-Lancia.com) under Fulvia, I was looking to see if Huib was still advertising DeCarbons, but no luck.
It might also be worth checking for a set of Monroe's for my 2c I couldn't get DeCarbons back in about 2000 so I bought a set of Monroe's from a friend who had bought them, for his 2000Hf but never fitted them, Can't say I've ever found them less than satisfactory.
Brian


Brand new KONI shock absorbers - front and rear
I have bought a set of KONI Classic shock absorbers in black colour. Koni part number: 80-1500 (front) & 80-1501 (rear). Unfortunately, they don't fit to my Lancia 2000 Coupé. Therefore I am going to sell them for a low price as EUR 300 + shipping (new price was EUR 430). They are absolutely new, in original box and never fitted to the car. They are located in Switzerland, but I will send everywhere. If you have questions, please contact me.
Sven, http://www.viva-lancia.com/i/bullc.gif sven@planningshop.ch (sven@planningshop.ch)


May11

[BlueS2]

I have the black Koni's on my S2. I got them from Omicron a couple of years ago when they could not supply deCarbon's (nor could anyone else). They seem fine, although I think they are a bit stiffer than I would like. However, they are nothing like the yellow Koni sports I put on one of my Alfas, and 15 years later you can still time the rebound damping with a sun dial (and that is if you can get them to compress in the first place...)

[1,6 HF]

Huib doesn't always have them in stock, but you can try here:
http://www.viva-lancia.com/huib/coll/de-carbon.htm

[fay66]

Huib doesn't always have them in stock, but you can try here:
http://www.viva-lancia.com/huib/coll/de-carbon.htm

I already looked yesterday at what was for sale on Viva-lancia but couldn't find these.

Brian

[Rick]

450045014502They are being made in Po4499land by Delphi. That's Poland.
http://www.lancisti.net/forum/images/misc/pencil.png

[1,6 HF]

Adan just got a set of Delphis, too. I believe Delphi makes two versions "comfort" and "performance". IMHO, "comfort" is pointless; with gas pressure monotubes, even the "performance" version has a smooth ride over minor road imperfections.

[jolly500]

Anyone know if these are available in the UK and if so from where??
Thanks
Steve

[scarmike]

Omicron has them. I'm waiting to hear back from them about prices.

[lancialulu]

I have bought 2 sets of "Delphi" decarbons REARS over the last three years but for the life of me cannot find my ebay records. I was not aware of the two standards comfort and perfomance and will look at the box next time I am in my workshop. Anyway they are fitted to my HF and 1600 Sport and I am very happy with then and as for handling I am not expert but my HF did 5 sessions at a recent LMC Goodwood track day and the only thing I coulld fault was my novice driving. There is a youtube of my car going through the chicane and it looks very stable. If these were comfort shocks then i am happy. BTW I set the car up very stiff on the front dialing in just 6 clicks from soft on new (24 click) Spax shocks. at 24 clicks the front of the car is solid and undrivable!!!

[scarmike]

From Omicron this morning: De Carbon shock absorbers are £ 81.79 each front or rear plus shipping.


You can also get them in Italy from http://www.ricambirossocorsa.it/new/it/cerca?orderby=position&orderway=desc&search_query=de+carbon but they are much more expensive.

[lancialulu]

I have checked my Delphi Decarbon Box - it says Comfort!! However read on....

The part number is V37 1112 23 and when googled various eastern european/russian sites come up and list it as rear gas "performance" shock absorber for Fulvia coupe and Flavias!

So I am happy. I have to say I paid a lot less than Omicron price when they appeared on ebay. But this is a good price anyhow.

Tim

[1,6 HF]

And if you can't trust a Bulgarian web site...

Sorry. Seriously even the Comfort version will give you good control. And on the rear, if there's a little more roll, it's not the worst thing in the world. But all things being equal, I'd probably go with the Performance.

[lancialulu]

Ed

I cant find a part number for performance. I believe Comfort and Performance are the same item. Do you have a part for the performance model and what is the build difference??

Tim

[Loconstant]

Hello,

For sport shock for Lancia fulvia, there are 2 brands in France.
Either
Via rouge:
http://www.amortisseurs-viarouge.com/ (tab VHC) (De carbon license)
which is really for competition.
Ref :
Fulvia 1.3, 1.6, 1.6 Zagato Sport 63-72
Front: V.37.1111.23 149 euros
Rear: V.37.1112.23 149 euros

Or
Koni: http://www.koni-shop.fr/
Fulvia, 1300C 63-76 C
Classic model (black)
Front: 80-1500 97,45 €/unit
Rear: 80-1501 91,06 euros ttc /uint
They are also adjustable

I personnally have the Koni, and set up them to nearly max "hardness" and they are ok for my usage like rally and hillclimb.

Cheers

[Rick]

Ed

I cant find a part number for performance. I believe Comfort and Performance are the same item. Do you have a part for the performance model and what is the build difference??

Tim

see post #24 photo 4 -- Part numbers seem all the same in Poland , France, et al-- these are marked Performance.. The mark-up on these are extraordinary as I found quite a few pairs in the UK at a vendor who had a fire sale on E-bay last summer. Can't find him. It must have been slow moving inventory. I bought a few and passed them around. I passed the name on to Ed and Tim but can't find it. Anyway, I think they have dried up.
Seems the license was bought by Delphi and the V numbers are all the same from the distributors no matter what country. There would be chaos if they weren't. The motor industry vendors are constantly in a state of flux so it's hard to say if the source willl last forever from this manufacturer by name. It would be a shame if Germany or Russia invaded Poland. The world would be upside down .. no more Fulvia shocks

[Rick]

Just talked to Kristick in Pennsylvania..he has shocks that might work for you.

[1,6 HF]

Tim,

I don't honestly know; Adan Figueroa has just bought some Delphis, and he's the one who told be about the distinction between the two types.

My DeCarbons are Corte e Cosso, which were only made in performance type. Corte e Cosso was a DeCarbon licensee who supplied the works team, and who was (I believe) the OEM for Fulvia shocks.

[Rick]

FWIW, the Corte e Cosso were on my car a '72 when I replaced them and they looked like the first set on the car based on mileage and condition. The stenciled name was visible.

[lancialulu]

Ed

Maybe its a S1 and post S1 thing as the S2 only lists 2 decarbons both for all models as I can make out including HF. The consice repair manual also lists 2 different decarbons (one for all and one for S2 berlina, S2 coupe, S2 sport, S2 sport 1600, and S2 HF1600). Interestingly the stated performance of these two are identical in their compression and extension figures.

I sugest that the labling of Performance and Comfort was a rather subtle for of niche marketing to put the same product into two different hands?

What say you??

Tim

BTW what was Adan's Decarbon part number - I bet it was the same as Rick and my purchases??



Tim,

I don't honestly know; Adan Figueroa has just bought some Delphis, and he's the one who told be about the distinction between the two types.

My DeCarbons are Corte e Cosso, which were only made in performance type. Corte e Cosso was a DeCarbon licensee who supplied the works team, and who was (I believe) the OEM for Fulvia shocks.

[1,6 HF]

...I sugest that the labling of Performance and Comfort was a rather subtle for of niche marketing to put the same product into two different hands?

What say you??
...

You'd get no argument from me there. I spoke to Adan, and the Delphi parts numbers are the same: V37 1111 23 front, and V37 1112 23 rear. The only difference is that the comfort are labeled "de Carbon Comfort" and the performance are labeled "de Carbon Performance". Doesn't make much sense to me that they have the same part number--it could be just labeling without a difference, but there it is.

In any case, I wouldn't be surprised if the HF stradales used the same units, relying on their reduced weight to increase the effective valving rates.

[dirk grandry]

PP receipt of May 19, 2010

LANCIA FULVIA REAR SHOCK ABSORBERS V37111223 * NEW *
Item# 230473093865
£29,99 GBP
2
£59,98 GBP
Shipping and handling
£55,00 GBP
Insurance - not offered
----
Total
£114,98 GBP
Payment
£114,98 GBP
Payment sent to ronandhaz@yahoo.co.uk
From amount
€139,00 EUR
To amount
£114.98 GBP
Exchange rate: 1 EUR = 0.827194 GBP

The seller wasn't that communicative and not that keen on sending these to the continent, hence the rather high shipping price.
Got 2 PAIRS (that's 4 rear shocks) for my 139.00 Euro.
They're labeled COMFORT on the box, but PERFORMANCE on the shock's label.
Front shocks were a bit more expensive at 32.50 PST/pair, but when I wanted to order these (after receiving the rears), bidders from out of the UK were no longer allowed.

[Rick]

Yes, that's the outfit I couldn't remember in Cheshire....they go by---- randh_products--- on E-bay. He wasn't too keen on sending them to the US so I had them drop shipped to a friend in the UK and he forwarded them on. Of course I did all this after omnly just paying twice as much from the usual sources. Oh, well, they should out live my car.