Need bushing - steering tie rod arm to rack

[grego]

Hi all,

My 78 Beta's steering went from great to canoe-like over a fairly short period of time. I parked it, figuring it was a tie rod or ball joint, both of which I have in my spares bins. Finally got around to it today, but after jacking the car and checking everything at the wheels, all of which looks clean and pretty new, I shook my right front wheel and it had all sorts of play. I followed this back to the steering rack and found that there is no bushing left at the arm-to-rack joint. Eek!
I began searching online and cannot find them. Admittedly, I do not know what to call it, so I've just been searching steering and suspension items.
Anyone have one/two? Or know what I should be searching for? Or have a diagram in case I need to make one?
I have stuff to trade or can send paypal, whatever.
Thanks in advance!
Greg O.
Denver

[Todd D.]

Greg,
I am familiar with this problem. That poor bushing gets toasted by the ex-manifold and its worse if you have a header. I solved my problem by taking the arm to a machine shop and having a bronze bushing turned to fit. That worked but it can be pricey. Recently I replaced
the bushing in a Zagato with a replacement bushing from an Intrepid. I can e-mail the part #
Its not an exact fit....I would say its .5mm too small but I installed it with eurethane rubber
then protected the 2 rack bolts with a little heat shield and all is good so far.
Todd

[grego]

Thanks Todd. I have no problem with improvising if it works and doesn't look like a hack job when it's done. Any info you can give me about how you did this would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Greg

[Todd D.]

Greg,
I have the part # at my shop and will get it to you tomorrow. The Chrysler Intrepid bushing
is a 2 part dense nylon piece with a steel shaft for the bolt to go through. The bolt hole is the exact right size. The application for the Intrepid is the inner tie rod bushing. I figured if it was meant to replace the same part on the Intrepid it should be good enough for the Lancia application. I'll get you the part # and you can check it out for yourself.
Todd

[grego]

Thanks Todd. No fire drill hurry, I've already begun a couple of other small repairs while it's down, but would be great to get the lowdown and any other info on how you made up the little bit of size difference.
Now, this isn't the place, but I see you have one of my favorite cars, besides Lancia, in your list. Early 530i - one of my all timers.

Thanks!
Greg

[Todd D.]

Maybe its not the place but....what the hell. The 530i is very similar to the Lancias in that
its a really nice , seriously under-rated and under valued car. Although she handles like a
pregnant roller-skate (it doesn't compare to a a beta) she can get you into trouble very quickly. The 3 liter straight six has
enough torque to spin you out in a tight dry corner......in 4th gear.
Thats something I'm pretty sure my Scorp can't do.
That car is a 4 door family sedan that is meant for high speed cruising on the Autobahn.
I love it. Pick one up if you get the chance. Its alot of car for not alot of money.
Todd

[grego]

I've owned two of them. A 77 and 79. Loved both. The 77 rusted as quickly as our favorite Italian cars from the era. The 79 went away to make room for a family van. Sad to see it go.

I saw one today at a local used car lot, and I'm hoping they are closed tomorrow so I can stop by and take a look, hassle free. I love the torque and endless pull of that six in a relatively small car. Great cars!
Apologies to the rest of you for the sidetrack...

G

[Todd D.]

Greg,
Here is the inner tie rod bushing part #.
Its TRW part# HB1647K , originally for a Chrysler Intrepid but I'm not sure what year.
Have a look and see what you think. The very slight gap was filled with black Eurethane rubber that comes in a caulking gun type tube. Its made to glue windshields in. Once cured it
is very firm. To be on the safe side, fabricate a heatsheild to protect just the 2 steering
rack bushings or make one a little bit bigger to protect the steering rack boot as well.
I attached mine to the right hand steering arm with 2 hose clamps so that the heat shield
moves with the steering arm. You just have to make sure it doesn't catch the rubber gator
when turning hard left.

[grego]

Thanks Todd! I'm on it. I like the idea of the heat shield, got my piece of thin sheet already set aside for the job. Is the eurethane rubber available at auto parts stores?

Thanks for the help. I'm feeling better about my chances of having this baby back on the road before winter, then all hell brakes loose: struts, brakes, tires, electrical, radiator, blah blah blah.

Greg

[SubGothius]

As another alternative, at least for cars with power steering, some have simply replaced the bad/missing rubber from the original bushing with a short section of ordinary heater hose, reusing the original metal sleeve in the center.

Also, Beta Boyz now offer polyurethane replacement bushings (http://www.betaboyz.co.uk/Catalogue.htm) for both manual and PS tie rods.

[FiatFactory]

or you could just replace the bush with an original lancia item .... 82293069 is the OE part number .... looks like this - I have a box full if you want one.

SteveC

[SubGothius]

or you could just replace the bush with an original lancia item .... 82293069 is the OE part number .... looks like this - I have a box full if you want one.
Good to know, but I think that's a different steering-related bushing than the one we've been discussing in this thread. The one you pictured is only for the manual (TRW) racks and fits inside the rack, rather than on the tierods; this page shows their application (http://www.betaboyz.co.uk/BBB06.htm).

[grego]

Thanks for all of the suggestions guys. As a stop gap, I did the piece of hard rubber hose. So far, it feels like a normal Beta again, but I don't expect that to last long. I'm currently chasing a tip that was emailed off this list regarding a Mustang part that is virtually identical in spec to the OE Lancia part. The tip did not specify year etc, so I'm trying to track it down. If I can confirm the match, I will certainly share with y'all. Apparently this item is available in original rubber and poly for the Mustang, and is obtainable at your local parts store.

For now, the car is back to going down the road with both wheels in the same direction, so I can hopefully track down a real replacement before the honeymoon ends with the current setup.
BTW, my car is a US spec with power steering.
Thanks again for all the help!

[davidb]

Grego: @ the risk of spending your money. If you will have to
pull the rack to get @ that bushing I'd consider a re-built ZF
P.S. rack replacement before all things go back together. Just
a thought to save you future greif. My rack has a tiny,nuisance
leak, won't improve. I'm NOT looking forward to that job. Luck ...

[grego]

Hi David, thanks. This bushing is actually surprisingly easy to get at, just behind the exhaust (my car has a header). So far, I haven't even had to mess with the steering arm at the other end. There's just enough room to get two hands in there and mess around. When it comes time to press in a new bushing (if it has to be), then I'll need to remove the arm from the tie rod end of things.

But! While working on this initially from below, I noticed a split in my otherwise very good looking rack boot. That replacement will require rack removal. Aaaggghhh! I don't even want to think about it. I've never done that, but I expect to be drenched in nasty fluid, covered with grease, and at least one step will be impossible for a human being to accomplish without injury or contortion.

Best of luck to us both!

[PAV]

I had a set of Delrons made up from Ray at Performance Apex.

He machined em up quite nicely and they are holding up very well.

pav

[grego]

Thanks PAV. I'm not familar with Performance Apex. Do you have an address or city so I can do a search?
Thanks!

[PAV]

Thanks PAV. I'm not familar with Performance Apex. Do you have an address or city so I can do a search?
Thanks!

www.performanceapex.com



here is the work they did on my Zagato.

http://www.performanceapex.com/paulszagato.htm


They do show the assembled rod ends to the steering box and at the very bottom they show the origional broken rod end bushings.

BR,

Paul

[grego]

Thanks for the links. Nice work on yours. I look at my engine bay and doubt it has ever looked so clean...

Although the shot of the wires at the radiator fan switch looks familiar, must have been an option or something!

G

[PAV]

So Greggo:

what did you finally do???

Let's see the pic!

BR,

PAV

[grego]

Hey, thanks for the note.

Well, so far, nothing! I bubblegummed it with the piece of hose trick, and have driven it maybe a couple hundred miles. It feels great. It's tight, steers nicely and tracks straight, but I can't stop thinking to myself that I have a chunk of heater hose acting as a steering rod bushing! I did place large washers front and back of the hose in the eye of the arm, so it can't go anywhere, but I expect heat and stress to shred it any day now.

I think I'm going to make a winter project out of this. Well, this and about fifty other things. But I will give an update when I have one. For the time being, I've just been enjoying the nice 60 and 70 degree temps and driving the Beta on local errands and such, enjoying it while I can.

GregO

[Jim Keller]

Uh, you might be surprised as to how long that setup will last, heater hose is made to resist chemicals, heat AND it's reinforced too! since you washered it, I wouldn't concern myself with it until such time it started wandering around again........unless your like me and HAVE to have it exactly right regardless...........damn anal people! LOL

[grego]

Thanks Jim. I am a bit bothered when I know something isn't 'right', but this car also needs so much done to it, that I have to prioritize. For instance, just did some under-car work and noticed a leaky wheel cylinder. That goes to the top of the list, bumping everything else down a notch., just like that. As long as the thing steers okay, the bushing need will most likely continue to be bumped. Thanks for making me feel a bit more comfortable leaving it alone for now, though!

Greg