Limited Slip Differentials being manufactured in the UK

[New Snakeman]

Hi All,

I have made some enquires regarding the manufacture of LSD's specifically for Lancia Montecarlos. I am guessing the Scorpion and the Beta trans diffs are the same.

As the GBP currency is weak at the moment, I was thinking the guys over the Pond may be interested.

If you are, then keep an eye on this link to the Montecarlo Consortium

http://www.montecarlo.org.uk/discus/messages/1/1060.html?1234545227 (http://www.montecarlo.org.uk/discus/messages/1/1060.html?1234545227)




After they examined a VX version that I had spare the manufacturer responded to me as follows:

"The previous Lancia LSD units we have produced are not close enough to your model to be of any use in aiding our production. We would have to produce a new design and set of drawings using the sample you have sent us for measurement.

We have an initial design and set-up cost of approx £500, with unit prices then @ £550 each. A one off production would cost £1050, 2 off £800 each, etc.

A Batch of 5 off would cost £650 each. "


The link to the manufacture is here

http://www.davemacprops.com/dmpgriptechnical.html (http://www.davemacprops.com/dmpgriptechnical.html)


The more people who want one the better

Let me know if you are interested

Kind Regards
Geoff W

[Will]

Hi All,

I have made some enquires regarding the manufacture of LSD's specifically for Lancia Montecarlos. I am guessing the Scorpion and the Beta trans diffs are the same.

As the GBP currency is weak at the moment, I was thinking the guys over the Pond may be interested.

If you are, then keep an eye on this link to the Montecarlo Consortium

http://www.montecarlo.org.uk/discus/messages/1/1060.html?1234545227 (http://www.montecarlo.org.uk/discus/messages/1/1060.html?1234545227)




After they examined a VX version that I had spare the manufacturer responded to me as follows:

"The previous Lancia LSD units we have produced are not close enough to your model to be of any use in aiding our production. We would have to produce a new design and set of drawings using the sample you have sent us for measurement.

We have an initial design and set-up cost of approx £500, with unit prices then @ £550 each. A one off production would cost £1050, 2 off £800 each, etc.

A Batch of 5 off would cost £650 each. "


The link to the manufacture is here

http://www.davemacprops.com/dmpgriptechnical.html (http://www.davemacprops.com/dmpgriptechnical.html)


The more people who want one the better

Let me know if you are interested

Kind Regards
Geoff W

Personally, I think that's not really worth it for a plate diff. I keep seeing helicals on ebay for $300 and wondering whether I could take the invex cluster and repackage it in a custom carrier and use the Honda or Toyota or whatever output shafts with an adaptor on the inner CV end. The problem is that I don't know how big any of the actual clusters are without biting the bullet and buying one, or a couple to compare. I could also use a junk Scorpion carrier to fool around with.

IMO it would be great if we could take another application's torsen diff and swap the ring gear plate to our custom ones and turn down the ends to fit our bearings and do a shaft swap and call it a day. And I'll bet there's a good possibility we could, if we set about it systematically.

[davidb]

D.J. & I discussed Scorp. LSD's on the phone some months
ago & Our Administrator pretty much threw cold water on
their utility. I defer to D.J.'s opinion. That said Dan C. had
one, new too. Dunno if he still has it.

[New Snakeman]

I would be interested to hear opinions on why in is not a viable application.

I have used my Monte for sprint events where wheel spin in cornering and fast starts has been an issue. This year I will be circuit racing so, for me, I am confident it will provide a benefit.

Cheers, Geoff

[DJ]

D.J. & I discussed Scorp. LSD's on the phone some months
ago & Our Administrator pretty much threw cold water on
their utility. I defer to D.J.'s opinion. That said Dan C. had
one, new too. Dunno if he still has it.

I think I should clarify this a bit. As I recall, our conversation was really in reference to cars like mine and David's which are intended to be road cars and not built for competetive events. In that context, I can't really see the justification for such an expense.

If I was building a racer, especially one with a much hotter engine, I imagine I'd have a different opinion regarding LSDs.

[davidb]

Sorry D.J., I should have said road cars as we discussed.

[Will]

Even for events as lowly as Solo 2, where our local venue is old asphalt polluted with loose sand and grit, the AWD and Posi cars pick up extra time over the cars with one wheel peel. The latter turn into street sweepers trying to power out of the little tight corners.

That said, I don't treally think a $2000-plus diff is all that justifiable for a scorpion either. At least, not with all the other uses I could put a couple extra grand to.

However for $500 and a few hours hobby machining time, I would do it. Especially for a real helical LSD.

The above option is for a plate LSD, and $1200 for that option I think is kinda moot. For one thing, I'd never adjust it anyway, so I could throw in a PG type spring block for a couple hundred bucks and be done with it. I can even make one of those at home in a couple hours and buy the springs from Phantom grip and call it a day. That's a one afternoon project and maybe $50 for the springs and install clips.

At least one member on here bought a helical LSD for several thousand dollars and had one of the outpput shaft crap out on him right off the bat , so spending a bag of money does not guarantee you great quality anyway. Anything you get is going to be custom and ultimately rely on the skill of the machinist that made it for you.

All IMO of course. But when I see those $300 helicals on the market, it get me thinking- if the carrier can be turned down small enough or the cover can be turned up large enough, and the body fits, especially the type with the bolt on ring gear carriers should be able to be modded to fit. A couple of new bearings for the ends are cheap, and matching up some donor output shafts isn't the end of the world in terms of difficulty either.

There is another advantage also to the relastively low power of our cars- what might be an iffy quality LSD for a 400HP hopped up Honda may survive a lifetime quite happily in a 160HP hopped up Scorpion.

[Ken H]

I'm running a torque-sensing LSD in my Scorpion and I am super impressed with how well it works. A waste of money if you're not running a lot of HP, but for me, now I can finally get all the power to the ground. There is a bit of weird stiction when starting cold at low speed with the steering wheel cranked, but no bad habits other than that. Except - you definitely need to avoid wheelspin when cornering as you will lose ALL cornering traction at the rear! I.e., instant spin.

My unit is a Transtad and might still be available although you'd probably need to line up a dealer or intermediary in Italy to do business with them. Don't know the price as I bought mine through a 3rd party, but it may compare favorably to trying to adapt one from another vehicle. Tom McGaffigan and Lonnie Dukes both bought Scorpion versions, and both immediately broke due to a bad batch of heat treating. I believe the vendor eventually made good on replacements and would guess that would not be a problem in future units. The LSD itself seems to be pretty tough.

- Ken H.