headlights

[JOHN KERR]

Massage for Tom.I like your new purchase with the four headlight system.I have the mounting brackets from a Lancia Beta and am now trying to work out the best way of fitting them.It would be very helpfull if you could show some pics of the way they are mounted in your black car ie any cutting of the original bodywork etc.

Many thanks in advance John Kerr

[Andrew S]

I'm going to jump in on this one!

John, hi
Forget about using the Beta lights/surrounds; they don't fit properly. The lights on Tom's car are Bosch units from a BMW. They are fitted to a custom made surround which fits the aperture perfectly. The light units themselves are glued to the surrounds; to alter the aim of the lights you adjust the surrounds. In practice, once adjusted at the fitting stage you'll only need to readjust if you bash 'em.

Andrew.

[JOHN KERR]

Hi Andrew
Thank you for the info.I also have the mounts etc from a bmw E30,which would need modifying to fit.I still think the mounts from the Beta could be made to fit,then you would have to make a closing panel to fill in between the grill and the ends of the nose cone,a suitable piece of plastic could be fabricated.

Thank you for your comments regards John

[lanciatomcat]

I was planning to take some pictures of the installation and post in the photo gallery.
If you look at my project pictures you will see it was delivered with a 4 headlamp system which needed to be replaced during the rebuild.
I am looking at the 4 Beta system, the BMW system as fitted and a 4 haedlamp system from a Capri.
More on this later.
Tom

[Will]

I don't know if you guys are removing the stock headlights or whether your cars had none, but just an an FYI don't throw out those plastic mounts for the stock headlights!

At one point it was nearly impossible to find those, at least in the states. Chad had lights for LHD cars, but the mounting "spiders" had to get scrounged up and were like gold.

They still may be very saleable! :)

[lanciatomcat]

My Project was purchased without the original lights at all. Any efforts I have made to get replacement originals have failed.
Options then became necessary.
I am undertaking a 'study' but everyone who has done a replacement 4 headlamp system appears to have tackled it in different ways.
It does seem clear that some modification to the corners are necessary. Some more than others.

[Geoff T]

Have you considered the quad headlight kit that Omicron puts out?
They use a standard 90 mm Hella light unit, which even has the park lights fitted if you want to use them.
The light output is way superior to the standard units, even on 55W bulbs. Lights can be set up for either left or right hand drive. The plastic covers could do with a bit of improving, but overall the kit fits well. The whole mounting systen attaches to the original Monte brackets, so no rework is required.
These lights are also fitted to the Pagaini Zhonda!
I fitted a set when I rebuilt my S2 after a whoopsie, which destroyed one std headlight and damaged the other. Those of you in the UK may find the price reasonable. Us out here in NZ have to triple the price, but at least I am back on the road, with a superior lighting system.

Geoff T

82 S2 Montecarlo

[Andrew S]

Hi Geoff,
I've seen that conversion on a couple of cars and, while I don't doubt it's performance, for me at least it doesn't suit the car. Too small and too modern. And waaaay too expensive! What a crazy price!!
The conversion I do costs £32.
Four Bosch lights (which are absolutely superb and very plentiful) from a scrap BMW in my local yard- £5 each. Small piece of 10mm perspex to make surrounds- £5. Bonding and adjuster screws- £7. A few hours work and the end result looks stunning as Tom's posted pictures (that I took) prove. That conversion was carried out because when I bought the car a couple of years ago the headlamps were totally rotted through, as are many Monte lamps. When I removed them (they also had broken plastic mountings Will) I found that the car had already had a small amount of metal removed to allow for the extra width of twin lights so I decided to fit some. The MOT man was very impressed with the conversion although it was only really a prototype for the idea. It could be improved further; better access to the adjuster screws etc. and I will make it better the next time I do it which will be on my current project.

Andrew.

[lanciatomcat]

I have trial fitted an original Beta 4 lamp system back plate into the recess left by the original headlights. Modification locally is required to the radiator side supports.
What I have not completed is a complete build-up with Beta covers etc and then looked at rear access to the adjusters.
The Bosch setup obviously works well and indication from others is that with some careful measurement etc the Beta system does fit and can be adjusted.
I do need more time to look at these possibilities in detail. I would not be changing the Bosch lamps on my new addition but would pursue the Beta arrangement on my Project as I have work to do on the front area.
Reference to my gallery would assist seeing the state of play there.
Tom

[JOHN KERR]

Thanks to all for the information.If using the Beta mounts access to the adjusters could be from inside the luggage area, a cutout i think is needed on the inside of the headlight area and a semi circular piece fabricated to fill in.A bracket top and bottom for the Beta mounts to bolt too and it would seem to be ok.I will be having a go this week on one side to see how it goes.

Regards John kerr

[lanciatomcat]

John
Sounds very similar to what I see happening.
I believe that the rear headlamp area needs the access enlarged and possible stiffening not to reduce integrity in this area.
It is possible to adapt the Beta front plates to fit over the metal headlamp fixing rings and for these to have top and bottom mountings made up.
Have you noticed that the dimensions of the Beta fixings top and bottom are different?
Regards
Tom

[JOHN KERR]

Hi Tom.I havn't noticed the difference in the mounts but I think the finishing piece of plastic at the ends of the grill will need to be fabricated to fit the returns on the nose cone.It will be an interesting exercise will keep posting.

Regards John Kerr

[lanciatomcat]

John
I am off to Spain for a week at a friend's villa.
On return will make it a priority to try and take a set of pictures showing what I see as the build up in this area.
I agree with you that modifications are required in some areas to get the Beta arrangement to work. It has been done though by others without 'major' alterations.
More after the 26th May.
Regards
Tom

[JGreenslade]

Does anyone know which reflectors were used in the rare 'pop-up' version of the Scorpion (i.e. the type seen in the Herbie film)? They're smaller than the single lamp variant seen in other Scorp's - is that correct?

Having said that, the only hope of obtaining some would be if they're Fiat parts bin... Can anyone shed any light?

Justin

[sprintcarfan]

Does anyone know which reflectors were used in the rare 'pop-up' version of the Scorpion (i.e. the type seen in the Herbie film)? They're smaller than the single lamp variant seen in other Scorp's - is that correct?

Justin

The lights in the Herbie movie were something Disney came up with for the movie. All the Scorpions used 7" lights.

[JGreenslade]

Well, that shows how much I know! I was reading a discussion that showed design study cars for the Monte, and there was a link to the film. I thought 'they're about the right size'... A clue would've been that, out of all the models, none had pop-up lamps. Maybe I should write a letter to Disney's prop dept.

Justin