DCNF Clearance Problems

[davidb]

Looks like I might have one of the taller Alquati intake
manifolds. Intake manifold, then phenolic spacers, then
DCNFs, then TMH fiberglass housing on top = interfer-
ence w/the engine cover strut bracket. Anyone en-
countered this & just sawed off that bracket? I'd hate to
do that & go the broomstick route but? Not a very tidy
solution. Lastly the phenolic spacers are as thin as they
get. No room for lowering things there. I'm not sure if
the lid will fit IF I cut the bracket off. Wanted to post
before I did any bastardizing [sawing]. AHHHHHHHH !!!!

[Jim Fierst]

It has been a few years ago but I remember having a similiar problem with the same manifold ,carbs and TMH airbox. I know that I ended up making a new rod to hold open the deck lid. I just looked at my old Scorpion pictures but nothing was evident. Perhaps someone with a "less fuzzy " memory will post.

[DJ]

Looks like I might have one of the taller Alquati intake
manifolds. Intake manifold, then phenolic spacers, then
DCNFs, then TMH fiberglass housing on top = interfer-
ence w/the engine cover strut bracket.

You have the CORRECT Alquati manifold. There is no tall Vs. short Montecarlo/Scorpion Alquati manifold. The shorter ones you may see referenced from time to time was a Mangoletsi sold by Pierce (and others I think) but it is really for the Betas, not the Monte/Scorpion. There are also some different Alquatis out there that are a bit different but they are NOT the correct manifold for the Montecarlo or Scorpion.

The TMH airbox requires relocation of the support brace mount. Once the bracket is relocated it WILL fit. They used to tell you this in their online ads but I don't know if they still do.

[Darren]

I take it by bracket, you mean the bit attached to the engine cover and not this

http://lancisti.net/photopost/data/531/thumbs/DSC000433.JPG (http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=6930)

I've not tried closing the rear deck yet - thanks for the heads up. Everything else fits great!

http://lancisti.net/photopost/data/531/thumbs/DSC000382.JPG (http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=6929)

http://lancisti.net/photopost/data/531/thumbs/DSC000313.JPG (http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=6928)

Cheers

[DJ]

I take it by bracket, you mean the bit attached to the engine cover and not this

Correct. The small right-angle piece that is spot-welded to the underside of the engine cover.

[davidb]

Thanks all! Yikes Darren those carb tops look totally different than
the set I bought from Andrew S., Jesus more bloody variations. I
spent hours & hours making a template & carefully drilling out the
bottom of my THM box. That said thanks for the pics, informative
yet scary @ once. Supposedly mine are 42 DCNFs. And thank you
D.J.. W/modifications of this nature I rather assumed some "radical"
measures would pop-up. I wanted to post 1ST before I did some
bastard saw job. What is necessary is just that. I always doubted
the 2 different height manifold "myth". M.C. is cast right into the
damn thing. + Scorpion or Monte or S1 or S2 it's the same damn
head, Christ. Appreciatedly yours.

[DJ]

I wanted to post 1ST before I did some
bastard saw job. What is necessary is just that.

Not really that big a job. Just get yourself a spotweld cutter bit for your drill motor. It pops right off once you cut the welds.

I just then used the holes to mount it slightly off from the normal spot with some large but SHORT sheet metal screws.

Best to cut, weld, then grind off the leftover nubs and repaint but I didn't have that my patience back then. Mine has since been welded back to it's original location when it was in the paint shop.

[Craiova]

Hi all, when I had my twin carb set up I had the manifold machined by 10mm to reduce the height, the bracket still fouled the top of the airbox, I also had to modify the airbox to bring it away from the gutter under the window to give some clearance for when the engine moves on the mounts, another piece of information, you lose 10bhp with that airbox, I know, I had comparrison runs done on a rolling road with and without the lid on the box.

Cheers Steve

[davidb]

That was my initial thought D.J.: drill thru the bracket welds &
re-locate the bracket elsewhere/offset w/sheetmetal screws.
Craiova I've heard of the HP loss. Mere intuition would indicate
same w/the factory air filter housing on the L.R. strut housing,
then the hose snaking to the Monte Hospital carb top: lotsa dis-
tance=lotsa suction lost. By the same token I've heard/read
that free flow top-carb mounted filters such as K&Ns are quite
noisy, dunno. I've never driven mine since purchased 18 months
ago for the re-furb. Candidly I'm ignorant of noise vs. HP loss
as yet. Thanks for advise . . .

[Craiova]

Mind you, to be fair to the Monte Hospital there is not a lot more you can do with the clearances that are there.
I've made my own airbox to fit twin downdraft throttle bodies which have a lot less height than DCNF's and I'm still having trouble with that darn bracket (it could be making a swift exit soon), gas strut would be on the cards if it didn't mean welding or drilling my shiny engine cover.

Steve

[Will]

I always found that bird-trap lid support to be downright dangerous, especially in combination with hoses and wall mounted cord reels like I use at home. after a few near-decapitations, I added gas lift struts. These are kinda cool because I can pull the release and the hood glides up with a neat hissing sound. Cost about $60 in parts because I used too-expensive struts form a marine supply, could probably be done for $30 on ebay. I had to make a hood support brace out of some 1-1/2" x 1/8" 6061 channel, but after paint it looks OEM.

No more brain damage (from that anyway) :)

[Craiova]

Do you have any photo's of that conversion Will?

Steve

[Will]

They are barely visible in user galleries/will/engine bay/picture_110. I can get some better pics for you if you are interested in replicating the setup, it is very simple as they sit vertically when compressed. They mount to the inside of the frame rail just aft of the left side strut tower, and connect to a short section of angle with a knob on it, which in turn screws to the brace that is attached to the lid. Thus, the lid is removable.

[davidb]

Good Lord, properly placed replacement struts for our engine
cover as opposed to the factory "stick/stay". Hydraulic no less.
I admit, neat solution. What a pain tho. On the one hand I'm
glad I started this thread. On the other I'm just trying to re-
solve my clearance issue. Nonetheless sage advise/experience
as always. One never knows where a question may go. A
viable solution/resolution is always appreciated on my end.
I maintain we are all mentally unbalanced fighting these cars.
After I'm done w/my Lancias I'm thinking of model airplanes
as a less expensive hobby. Back to my DCNFs I go: AHHHHH!

[Darren]

Hi David,

The ones I have are 40's - I have no idea if they'er different or not - I kinda figured they'd be the same, just a bit bigger! ;o)) All seems to be ok with the fit now - thanks to the design that the outline of the carbs is scored in below. Used that and had no probs at all. The pipe I have will need a bit of work to get it to fit properly though. I'll post up some more pics once I've got it sorted.

I hear you on the manifold issue - glad I seem to have the right one for the car. I just need to get it running now!!

Cheers


Thanks all! Yikes Darren those carb tops look totally different than
the set I bought from Andrew S., Jesus more bloody variations. I
spent hours & hours making a template & carefully drilling out the
bottom of my THM box. That said thanks for the pics, informative
yet scary @ once. Supposedly mine are 42 DCNFs. And thank you
D.J.. W/modifications of this nature I rather assumed some "radical"
measures would pop-up. I wanted to post 1ST before I did some
bastard saw job. What is necessary is just that. I always doubted
the 2 different height manifold "myth". M.C. is cast right into the
damn thing. + Scorpion or Monte or S1 or S2 it's the same damn
head, Christ. Appreciatedly yours.

[Darren]

Will, I'd definitely be interested in replicating your setup and if you could post up some more pics that would would be great, thanks!

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

Dzjeeezzz, i'm really looking forward to installing my 40 DCNF's after reading all of this :-)

So basically the (expensive) MTH glassfibre airbox is a pain to fit. And they should have said this when selling it? And once installed you lose 10 bhp. OMG. And then there's the throttle issue as well. Nice nice NOT!

Regarding the airbox, i bet this is the best solution then:

http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2272

In the rest of the album there are some DCNF piccies as well, for anyone interested.

Does anyone know where to get those K&N DCNF airboxes, in the right height?

Cheerio, Pieter

p.s. hope the brake upgrades from TMH are a better fit

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

Mind you, to be fair to the Monte Hospital there is not a lot more you can do with the clearances that are there.
I've made my own airbox to fit twin downdraft throttle bodies which have a lot less height than DCNF's and I'm still having trouble with that darn bracket (it could be making a swift exit soon), gas strut would be on the cards if it didn't mean welding or drilling my shiny engine cover.

Steve


Steve, d'ya have any pictures of that airbox?

Cheers, Pieter

[davidb]

TMH ships the airboxes as blanks due to carb throat variances. In
retrospect Otto the cut isn't that bad. I used a plumbers putty pan-
cake as a template. Kids Play-Dough would work too. Drill a center
pilot hole for the 4 throats. A 1 3/4" hole saw "bit" is the EXACT size
of 42 DCNF throat perimeters. A hacksaw takes care of the other
orifices. Obviously drill from the bottom smooth GRP shiny side.
If I can find 'em I'd be curious to do a "seat-of-the-pants" com-
parison between K & N filters & the MH airbox for any power dif-
ference. And my ears for differing noise levels. I've heard K & Ns
are much more loud. Almost to an irritating degree. But if it's a
8-10 HP increase [which I find hard to believe] maybe it's worth
the noise. One could always swap 'em back & forth.

[Andrew S]

A 10bhp loss? That's a disaster, I'd say. Twin-carbs to gain power; airbox to lose it. What's all that about?!
David, K&Ns are definitely louder but they won't lose you 10 horses that's for sure.
The twin 40's that are fitted to my spyder project have a single baseplate and a single foam-type filter across both carbs that just clips on. Very neat and easy to fit/remove. Made by Pipercross. I have no idea if it's still available as it was fitted by the PO a few years ago.

Andrew.

[Darren]

Dzjeeezzz, i'm really looking forward to installing my 40 DCNF's after reading all of this :-)

So basically the (expensive) MTH glassfibre airbox is a pain to fit. And they should have said this when selling it? And once installed you lose 10 bhp. OMG. And then there's the throttle issue as well. Nice nice NOT!

Regarding the airbox, i bet this is the best solution then:

http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2272

In the rest of the album there are some DCNF piccies as well, for anyone interested.

Does anyone know where to get those K&N DCNF airboxes, in the right height?

Cheerio, Pieter

p.s. hope the brake upgrades from TMH are a better fit

Hi Pieter,

You're comparing chalk with cheese my friend! The airbox is not exactly a pain to fit, it just needs a bit of work. Once it's on you can appreciate how accurate the tooling is! It's not designed with performance in mind - if you want performance and noise, go with the pancake filters - if you want looks and a slightly more acceptable level of noise at the expense of bhp - go with the MH airbox. It flows as much as it can given the fact that it's attached to the original filter box.

Not tried the brakes yet - but if they're as good a fit as the airbox, you'll be well pleased!

[davidb]

Now that gas struts have been brought up can someone post some
pics? Looks like 16" is ideal. I went to AutoZone today but can't
figure out the proper attatchments bits. I see none that will provide
for horizontal to almost fully upright opening. Thanks.

[Frezer]

Pieter, If you're afraid loosing too many horses, you could also keep your airbox and install a K&N filter at the original S2 air filter location as a compromise. That's a considerably further away from your ears than those on-top-of-the-carb-filters.

Btw, does anyone know of K&N inserts for the original Montecarlo filter housings? I know those are available for the Beta i.e.

[DJ]

Btw, does anyone know of K&N inserts for the original Montecarlo filter housings? I know those are available for the Beta i.e.

TMH sells a JR Everlasting Filter (http://www.montehospital.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=27_22&products_id=542) which is essentially the equivalent. I have one.

[davidb]

A FRAM CA9345 [paper] fits, kinda. I RTV the filter base in the
air cleaner housing, centered of course & let it dry. It's not
precisely keyed but the circumference & height is perfect.
Plus for $18 dollars @ AutoZone or wherever as opposed to
the better part of $100 US from TMH [w/shipping]? Christ.
Always kills me when I see the top of the air filter housing:
"Replace filter every 6,000 miles". At $100 a pop, please...

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

You're comparing chalk with cheese my friend! The airbox is not exactly a pain to fit, it just needs a bit of work. Once it's on you can appreciate how accurate the tooling is! It's not designed with performance in mind - if you want performance and noise, go with the pancake filters - if you want looks and a slightly more acceptable level of noise at the expense of bhp - go with the MH airbox. It flows as much as it can given the fact that it's attached to the original filter box.


Hoi Darren, i might have completely misunderstood (i can't understand fully what has been written in english) but if i'm right then:

-MH airbox and the enginebonnet underthingie can touch each other?
-MH airbox loses 10 bhp, but how many will be gained with twin DCNF set up, i bet not much more then 15 bhp? Are there any rolling roads graphs of different setups?

I like the design of the MH airbox, for sure, but when i read on their website ... :

http://montehospital.com/pdf_files/performance_exhaust_and_carbs.pdf

"we are currently re working the entire moulds for this [the airbox that is] to improve the ease of fitting and acces to the intakes."

... then what to think of it?

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

All seems to be ok with the fit now - thanks to the design that the outline of the carbs is scored in below. Used that and had no probs at all.

Darren, sorry to ask (english is not my native language) but do you mean that: "the base is marked ready to cut out for 40 DCNF carburettors" as is stated here:

http://montehospital.com/pdf_files/performance_exhaust_and_carbs.pdf

So when using that, you won't have any clearance troubles?

Looking at this pic:

http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=6928

I wonder what will happen if the engine "moves" ...

[davidb]

Please read or re-read my prior post Otto. TMH ships the airboxes
as blanks now: no template, no scoring, no scribing. As we say in
ths States D.I.Y. meaning: "Do-It-Yourself". And forget about the
red paint on the banding & Lancia logo they show in some of their
pictures on the top half. Another D.I.Y. my friend.

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

Please read or re-read my prior post Otto. TMH ships the airboxes
as blanks now: no template, no scoring, no scribing. As we say in
ths States D.I.Y. meaning: "Do-It-Yourself". And forget about the
red paint on the banding & Lancia logo they show in some of their
pictures on the top half. Another D.I.Y. my friend.

I understand. My airbox has the markings still on it. Probably for 40 CDNF setup. As i'm using an camshaft-end distributor, i can try and move the airbox further away, opposite to where the rear window is. To get me some more clearance just in case the engine "moves".

Regarding the power loss. Look how it's done in a Ferrari 246 Dino.

http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2264&ppuser=42

Not that brilliant either. They use those "trumpet" things:

http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2242&ppuser=42

Cheers, Pieter

[Craiova]

The reason the airbox loses 10hp, so I am told by the great man himself (Guy Croft) is because the lid is too close to the top of the carbs, he told me you need 50mm clearance and there is no way you can get that.
I had 137bhp at the flywheel with twincarbs with 32mm chokes, Guy Croft exhaust, MH airbox, MH performance filter and a Guy Croft engine built for 150bhp, when we took the top of the box it went up to 147 and if I could have got the right chokes, 34mm ,we would have easily got the 150bhp, just as the great man said, so if it's Hp your looking for side drafts or FI is the way to go.
A word in the defense of the MH and downdrafts, that setup does drive nicely.

Steve

[Darren]

Hoi Darren, i might have completely misunderstood (i can't understand fully what has been written in english) but if i'm right then:

-MH airbox and the enginebonnet underthingie can touch each other?
-MH airbox loses 10 bhp, but how many will be gained with twin DCNF set up, i bet not much more then 15 bhp? Are there any rolling roads graphs of different setups?

I like the design of the MH airbox, for sure, but when i read on their website ... :

http://montehospital.com/pdf_files/performance_exhaust_and_carbs.pdf

"we are currently re working the entire moulds for this [the airbox that is] to improve the ease of fitting and acces to the intakes."

... then what to think of it?

Hi Pieter,

No apologies needed my friend!

Correct - engine stay mounting on engine cover will touch MH airbox
No idea on the comparative losses or otherwise on twins and MH box. I would be inclined to send Rodders at the Monte Hospital an email and see if the improvements have been made.

If you want noise and performance go for the K&N's or maybe fabricate something using the MH box and maybe a K&N panel filter?? Keep us posted anyway!

Cheers

[Darren]

Darren, sorry to ask (english is not my native language) but do you mean that: "the base is marked ready to cut out for 40 DCNF carburettors" as is stated here:

http://montehospital.com/pdf_files/performance_exhaust_and_carbs.pdf

So when using that, you won't have any clearance troubles?

Looking at this pic:

http://lancisti.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=6928

I wonder what will happen if the engine "moves" ...

I got my box a while ago, and hadn't realised that they stopped marking out the bases, but I guess that if there is a different between 40's & 42's then they'd have to have 2 different sets made.

I can't see any clearance issues now that the box is on and I've fitted new bushes to the mounts, so I'm hoping there won't be any movement, or at least not enough to cause damage!

Cheers

[Darren]

The reason the airbox loses 10hp, so I am told by the great man himself (Guy Croft) is because the lid is too close to the top of the carbs, he told me you need 50mm clearance and there is no way you can get that.
I had 137bhp at the flywheel with twincarbs with 32mm chokes, Guy Croft exhaust, MH airbox, MH performance filter and a Guy Croft engine built for 150bhp, when we took the top of the box it went up to 147 and if I could have got the right chokes, 34mm ,we would have easily got the 150bhp, just as the great man said, so if it's Hp your looking for side drafts or FI is the way to go.
A word in the defense of the MH and downdrafts, that setup does drive nicely.

Steve

Hi Steve,

That wouldn't be Steve H would it?? I guess the other option would be to rework the engine cover??

Cheers

[DJ]

Always kills me when I see the top of the air filter housing: "Replace filter every 6,000 miles". At $100 a pop, please...

You're missing one thing here David. The TMH JR filter is a "forever" filter like the K&N. You wash it, re-oil it, and use it again. No replacement needed.

[DJ]

If you want noise and performance go for the K&N's

That should read "If you want a LOT of noise..." ;) They are REALLY loud. Even with the TMH housing it was louder than I liked. If I was building the car more for performance it would be different but I was after more of a pleasant but sporty driver with my car.

[DJ]

I got my box a while ago, and hadn't realised that they stopped marking out the bases, but I guess that if there is a different between 40's & 42's then they'd have to have 2 different sets made.

I can't see any clearance issues now that the box is on and I've fitted new bushes to the mounts, so I'm hoping there won't be any movement, or at least not enough to cause damage!

Cheers

Darren is that picture a bit deceptive? The box should just tuck under the parcel shelf. Is that not the case with yours?

When I fitted my box I found it advantageous to cut the box so that it sat slightly to the right and slightly rearward instead of being perfectly centered. That gave a small amount more room for the dizzy and parcel shelf.

[Craiova]

Hi Darren, yes it is me Steve H, the only real way to deal with the issue is get the manifold skimmed, I had mine done by 10mm and I wish I had had it done by 20, then make your own airbox but you would still have to get rid of the engine stay bracket because you need the extra depth in the box for the carb clearance.
I have now made my own aibox for my throttle body setup and that bracket is still in the way, it's gotta go.

Steve

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

Correct - engine stay mounting on engine cover will touch MH airbox


Cheers Darren. Can the engine cover be closed then (apparantly yes :-) without causing damage or vibrating noises?

Maybe it's better to make a completely modified engine cover!

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

The reason the airbox loses 10hp, so I am told by the great man himself (Guy Croft) is because the lid is too close to the top of the carbs, he told me you need 50mm clearance and there is no way you can get that.
I had 137bhp at the flywheel with twincarbs with 32mm chokes, Guy Croft exhaust, MH airbox, MH performance filter and a Guy Croft engine built for 150bhp, when we took the top of the box it went up to 147 and if I could have got the right chokes, 34mm ,we would have easily got the 150bhp, just as the great man said, so if it's Hp your looking for side drafts or FI is the way to go.
A word in the defense of the MH and downdrafts, that setup does drive nicely.

Very interesting Steve, and nice to read that the DCNF's drive nicely, because that is my maingoal (did'nt like the two step 34 DATR character). The other thing is, relatively to the base setup (standard carb [that also uses a not to optimal suction traject] and exhaust), the DCNF's and sportexhaust must gain something in peak power and torque. Anyone overhere know what's at the flywheel of a completely standard S2 Monte?

Ciao, Pieter

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

Hi Darren, yes it is me Steve H, the only real way to deal with the issue is get the manifold skimmed, I had mine done by 10mm and I wish I had had it done by 20, then make your own airbox but you would still have to get rid of the engine stay bracket because you need the extra depth in the box for the carb clearance.
I have now made my own aibox for my throttle body setup and that bracket is still in the way, it's gotta go.

Mmm, why did the make it so high i wonder. Looking at it:

http://lancisti.net/photopost/data/641/Alquati_2.jpg

there's "flesh" enough to make it lower. Maybe getting problems with throttle linkage when machining it to low? Just a thought (more a worry :-).

[Craiova]

Hi, I was at a rolling road session some while ago, before I got my car on the road, Steve Baker who has a standard monte apart from the exhaust made 99bhp at the wheels which equates to 123bhp at the flywheel, you lose approx 24bhp from flywheel to the wheels.
As Lancia quote 120bhp Steve's car came out very well.

It would be relatively easy to modify the throttle linkage if you lowered the manifold.

Steve

[Will]

Now that gas struts have been brought up can someone post some
pics? Looks like 16" is ideal. I went to AutoZone today but can't
figure out the proper attatchments bits. I see none that will provide
for horizontal to almost fully upright opening. Thanks.

I can draw up dimensioned parts, I'm smack in the middle of reprototyping a project right now and everyone else is waiting for me, but give me a couple weeks and I can post sketches and dimensions in a new thread. That way it won't hijack this thread and the people that don't have airbox issues but want to install the struts can find it too. Fab time was only about two hours once I figured out the "how".

[Darren]

Darren is that picture a bit deceptive? The box should just tuck under the parcel shelf. Is that not the case with yours?

When I fitted my box I found it advantageous to cut the box so that it sat slightly to the right and slightly rearward instead of being perfectly centered. That gave a small amount more room for the dizzy and parcel shelf.

Hi DJ,

I trusted to what had been scored on the bottom and bit of luck! The box does sit ever so slightly under the parcel shelf so you have to angle the lid in rather than take it straight off. Clearance round the dizzy is tight, but certainly sufficient. I got a spare Vx head from Ebay so I now have a few more bits for my cam dizzy conversion.

Cheers

[Darren]

Hi Darren, yes it is me Steve H, the only real way to deal with the issue is get the manifold skimmed, I had mine done by 10mm and I wish I had had it done by 20, then make your own airbox but you would still have to get rid of the engine stay bracket because you need the extra depth in the box for the carb clearance.
I have now made my own aibox for my throttle body setup and that bracket is still in the way, it's gotta go.

Steve

Hey Steve,

I think that will have to wait for the winter - I need to get the car on the road rather than give meeslf more work to do! I have the same problem with the engine cover stay bar. Will has a great mod with gas shocks, so I think I'll wait for more info on that and make do with a broom stick for now!

I have a spare engine cover, so I think a bit of experimentation might be order of the day! ;o))

[Darren]

I can draw up dimensioned parts, I'm smack in the middle of reprototyping a project right now and everyone else is waiting for me, but give me a couple weeks and I can post sketches and dimensions in a new thread. That way it won't hijack this thread and the people that don't have airbox issues but want to install the struts can find it too. Fab time was only about two hours once I figured out the "how".

Excellent Will thanks - leave it with you and look forward to seeing the post.

Cheers

[Darren]

Cheers Darren. Can the engine cover be closed then (apparantly yes :-) without causing damage or vibrating noises?

Maybe it's better to make a completely modified engine cover!

Yes, but you have to move or remove the stay bracket - modified engine cover will be the next step. I just need to find out what air there is over the engine cover and in what direction!

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

Yes, but you have to move or remove the stay bracket - modified engine cover will be the next step. I just need to find out what air there is over the engine cover and in what direction!

Djeez, so i actually spend 130 UK pounds on an airbox that will not fit and will be damaged when using it.

[Andrew S]

Djeez, so i actually spend 130 UK pounds on an airbox that will not fit and will be damaged when using it.

Ha ha ha haaaa! And people say technology marches onwards, eh? Let's face it; nothing is straightforward when modifying a Monte.

Andrew.

[Darren]

Djeez, so i actually spend 130 UK pounds on an airbox that will not fit and will be damaged when using it.

Pieter, you are definitely someone who considers their glass to be half empty, not half full!:) Your airbox will fit as long as you take your time on the prep work. It won't be damaged as long as you remove the bracket! That should be noted on the website - I'll drop Rodders an email on the subject.

Roll on Will's specs so we won't miss the bracket and we can have self raising engine covers!!

[davidb]

It WILL fit, airbox. Many others have done it. As opposed to being
mired in conjecture take the plunge: buy one. W/that level of in-
vestment you'll MAKE it fit. Trust me . . .

[Otto-valvole-per-tutte]

Pieter, you are definitely someone who considers their glass to be half empty, not half full!:)

Darren, a glass in my hand, wether half full or half empty always gets empty before you know it :-)

Guess this is still the best option, regarding power and underbonnetfit: http://lancisti.net/photopost/data/641/Luchtfilterruimte_Monte.jpg

and then i'll make a vase out of the MTH airbox :-)

[Darren]

Darren, a glass in my hand, wether half full or half empty always gets empty before you know it :-)

Guess this is still the best option, regarding power and underbonnetfit: http://lancisti.net/photopost/data/641/Luchtfilterruimte_Monte.jpg

and then i'll make a vase out of the MTH airbox :-)

LOL, good one - I get the same feeling with bottles of wine! :D

Best get some ear protection too if you're going that route - or a loud stereo!

Are you that the MH box will hold water? ;o))

[lanciatomcat]

I have read this thread with great interest as I have all the pieces from TMH to go the DCNF and airbox route.
Not being done tomorrow but nevertheless will look at all aspects very carefully.
Thank you gentlemen for the comments made to date.
Tom

[Darren]

Glad to be of assistance - feel free to email me if you need any more info or pics Tom

[Geoff T]

Darren,
I have fitted a set of 40 DCNF 12's that I got from DJ to my S2 and had these clearance problems also. Here's what I did;
1. Mount the carbs without the phenolic gaskets. The heat transfer from the engine is negligable due to the crossflow design, and I have not had any trouble so far. Fit the gaskets though! I had to modify the manifold slightly to clear the throttle linkage, but not a biggie.
2. Extend the Alternator top bracket and fit a longer V belt. Alternator still uses the lower mount.
3. Trimmed 1/4" from the top of the airbox so the top fits under the rear lip. Fibreglass is easy to cut with a small saw.
4. Removed the original engine cover stay bracket and made a new one to fit onto the lid further rearward. I managed to secure mine with nuts and bolts to the doubler. Tricky to get the nuts in, but can be done. I also shortened the stay by about 1 inch so that it still fits under the lid (just!).
5. The S2 has a different air filter arrangement which goes straight on to the MH airbox in it's original position. I have replaced the original filter bin with a K+N pod filter. Can't see how you can lose 10 BHP with the MH airbox. It is about the same area as the std single carb setup X2.
Twin carbs definately transform even a standard motor as mine is. More torque and better fuel use than with the single carb. My touring MPG has improved by 3 (to 33 mpg imperial) with the carbs fitted. Alquati state a 20 BHP increase with twin carbs, and it is there!
It seems every Monte is different. Some have more clearance problems that others. Low volume build differences maybe?
Still worth the effort in the end!

Geoff T
82 S2 Monte.

[Darren]

Hi Geoff,

Thanks for the info - there must be a difference dimensionwise between 40's and 42's as the only thing I had to do was the remove the engine cover stay bar.

I may well experiment and try a different filter, but for now my piority is to get the carbs set up and the car on the road.

Cheers