What mods are REALLY worth it?

[Nasty Matt]

Having had a totally standard 16v for a few years I have finally purchased an evo 2. I do want to modify it (the evo) some what but have not decided beyond fe springs, chip, exhaust, diff craddle and rear strut what to do.

So my question is.. what mods you have done to your car that you have said "wow.. that really made a difference".

I have no intention of tracking my car so £2k on a set of anchors doesn't really seem worth while for me... for example.

Matt

[HuggyBear]

hi Matt,

If you're not going on track, i can recommend a few mods you can do for your evo, which differ from your own list.

1. Keep the standard springs. IMO they are better than FE springs for road only use.

2. try to eradicate understeer, try a few or all these ways.
a. Optimise your geometry, run more toe-in at the front.
b. fit an adjustable castor kit.
c. fit a stiffer anti-rollbar
d. run increased negative camber (track only though)

3. Water spray/Lotus chargecooler, this will minimise the power drop on hot days.

4. I think you'll be ok with the standard brakes, but if your increased performance comprises your braking, i can recommend Mintex 1144 pads with SRF fluid for road use.

5. Tyres - Personally I would only fit Toyo Proxies, Bridgestone So2/So3
or Michelin Pilot Sports.
6. EVOII's are quite good as regards to lag. But there are ways to make it even better.
a. fit a titanium roller bearing turbo.
b. fit a cone filter along with moving the intercooler forward. Note: The cone filter MUST sit in a separate compartment.
c. fit the Lotus chargecooler, this reduces the charge volume, thus less lag.
d. Increase the compression ratio, i haven't seen this on an evoII but on an evoI the lag was around the same as an evoII but, obviously with the benefits of a larger turbo.

Hope this helps,

Derrick.

BTW with all these mods it would be a shame not to take the car to the track, you should kick plenty of butt!

[J8N HF]

Matt
Air filter and Exhaust is a good starting point... you can then move on to a bazza chip and see some real power improvements...
Not wanting to upset Mr H Bear, but ive heard that the adjustable castors are not a great idea as they can be viewed as a bit of a weak point on the suspension :?
plus depending on how far you want to go, a very well respected ride and handling engineer once told me that the best way to get your car handling well is to fit a decent seat and a decent harness, 2's have decent seats already so that just leaves the harness...
Cheers
Jon

[base5]

More info on waterspray systems (AutoSpeed article):
waterspray 1 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0527/page1.html)
waterspray 2 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0534/page1.html)
waterspray 3 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0574/page1.html)
waterspray 4 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0578/page1.html)
waterspray 5 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0589/page1.html)
waterspray 6 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0827/page1.html)

More info on Boost control (also an AutoSpeed article):
DIY boost control 1 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0670/page1.html)
DIY boost control 2 (http://www.autospeed.com/A_0685/page1.html)
I'd not use this type of boost control, but the way they reduce wastegate creep in this article (especially part 2) is very interesting.

Base

[HuggyBear]

J8N HF,

The only castor kit that has been questioned (by Base) is the Walkers/Prestocar item. There are other castor kits available Bob Brain Developments's for example.

Personally I think the Walkers/Prestocar would be fine as these items have been heavily tested in hillclimbing and rally competition. :wink:

Derrick.

[evosapper]

Matt I know from the other side that you are thinking of getting the Kat removed, that must be a good place to start, as for the rest well the biggest jump in performance I noticed was after the chip and 3" exhaust. I do however think that you would be better just going for the exhaust. The problem of reliabilty should not be in question with just the pipe! but when you do begin to adjust boost and the rest, other stuff come into play!

[K10 EVO]

Derrick,

The Mintex 1144 any good for every day driving? I'm on Redstuff at the moment and am not too keen on the warm up time for them, but they will need replacing after Elvington next week anyhow so am looking for something else to replace them with next.

Andy

[HOLZEREVO]

Matt,

If you really want a very rare modification...take the chargecooler route...from Barry it will cost you about £1645 fitted. What have you then got? Well:

1. Something that not a lot of people have (...can probably count them on the fingers of one hand at the moment?)
2. Less lag
3. Improved off boost performance (smaller charge volume)
4. Increased power and torque
5. No heat soak (which you get at low speeds with the standard intercooler)
6. Consistent performance

The chargecooler conversion is not hugely expensive when compared with the installation of a waterspray kit for the intercooler (I believe Barry does a spray kit fitted for about £600-£700), and the chargecooler route has huge advantages and gains over the spray option.

I would also advise you to remap or chip the car to take full advantage of the chargecooler.

Another mod which will pay great dividends is to really get your suspension sorted...even if it means spending £1000-£2000...if you speak to virtually anyone who has had their suspension PROPERLY sorted...they will say it is one of the best mods they had done. Sorted suspension on an otherwise standard car, will run rings round a modified-engined car with suspension which hasn't been sorted.

An excellent 'safety' mod is the fitment of either or both of the following:

A. Baffled Oil Sump (Good)

B. Accsusump Oil Accumulator (Best)...both combined (Excellent)

...both of which will assist in the prevention of oil surge (and hence a blown engine) when you enjoy yourself a little too much by trying to pull 2G round a bend (and grip levels will be greatly improved with 'sorted' suspension).

Regards,

Neil

[J8N HF]

Neil, I might be missing something here so please feel free to point it out, but my evo has a bag in the boot and a spray nozzle on the bumper pointing to the intercooler, surely it cant cost £700 for it to be connected?? or does Bazza offer a different thing :?:
Jon
ps what type of Alpina do you have, a mate of mine used to have the B10 Bi-Turbo, very, very quick on the straights but i used to kill him on the bends 8)

[Bazza]

Neil, I might be missing something here so please feel free to point it out, but my evo has a bag in the boot and a spray nozzle on the bumper pointing to the intercooler, surely it cant cost £700 for it to be connected?? or does Bazza offer a different thing :?:
Jon


Neil was referring to the fitting of a water spray kit to a car that does not already have one - only the first 2500 Evo 1s had such a kit from the factory.

[J8N HF]

Ahhh, thanks Barry, so whats the procedure for connecting the sucker up then?? in a nutshell that is :D
Cheers
Jon

[Nasty Matt]

Thanks for the replies a lot of good stuff.

The only thing I am surprised at is no one has mentioned a decent manifold.. is this because the power gains are not that impressive?

I test drove an evo 2 that had some very impressive off boost performance (I'm not saying who's it was but I'm fairly sure one or two of you will know who's it was) Now.. I like the sound of the charge cooler. I've always thought a charge cooler would give optimum performance all of the time rather than giving additional performance.

Can some one explain why a charge cooler will be betetr than a water spray kit? And why were these not on the rally car originally?

As for the suspsension..... I think I would have to go in a modified grale before I pumped £1k-£2k into it.

[Bazza]

Jon - if you go to the FAQ section on Delphi I think you will find there were quite a few postings on how to connect the water spray unit.

Matt - charge coolers were not fitted to the rally cars as the parts were never homologated

[Nasty Matt]

Are the charge coolers worth it in your opinion Bazza? (I know your going to say yes as you do a kit"!!!) :lol:

[HuggyBear]

Derrick,

The Mintex 1144 any good for every day driving? I'm on Redstuff at the moment and am not too keen on the warm up time for them, but they will need replacing after Elvington next week anyhow so am looking for something else to replace them with next.

Andy

Hi Andy,

I've had mintex 1144 on the road and they are good pads. There is no initial warm-up phase and they are quite fade resisitant. When they are very hot, they don't give the same awesome bite as 'redstuff' would, but for road conditions they are really good, plus they are cheap.

Hope this helps.
Derrick.

[HuggyBear]

Matt,

Sorted suspension on an otherwise standard car, will run rings round a modified-engined car with suspension which hasn't been sorted.

Neil

Neil,
This just isn't true. It seems you are talking theoretical yet again.

Of the many instances I could give you, i will detail just one….

One day last year, Carlo, Kenny, Stelios and me (+plus several others)went to Oulton Park. It was the first time we had all attended a trackday which all of us were new to the circuit(except Carlo, its his local track).

We where all timed by several people throughout the day, without naming names, the people with the most advanced suspension (and better drivers) were on average 2 seconds per lap slower than me. Carlo had a 40bhp advantage, I had about 30bhp more.

This tells you that while having decent suspension is an obvious plus, the difference is not as great as you have supposed. The evo Integrale has a very good suspension to start with and as we are talking about road cars, it would be a bit silly to have track suspension used on British roads. Plus I assume you know the damage the previously mentioned suspension causes to body shells!

Please don't take it as a dig at you, but most of your experience is just theoretical and i felt I had to point that out. No offence intended.


Derrick.

[Bazza]

Are the charge coolers worth it in your opinion Bazza? (I know your going to say yes as you do a kit"!!!) :lol:

If you are keeping your car relatively standard then the only advantage is improved throttle response. Much more than 250 BHP/1.3 Bar boost and they really are worthwhile because they are much more efficient at getting the charge temperature down.

[HOLZEREVO]

Matt,

"The only thing I am surprised at is no one has mentioned a decent manifold"

OK, then...an excellent modification is a decent manifold (more power & torque, less lag, engine revs more easily, off boost performance improved). But if you are going down this route (better engine breathing characterstics), you might as well do the big bore exhaust, and flowed head and inlet manifold thing too, plus a new chip or remap.

Previously, I have had a Holzer manifold fitted, but currently have the Racing Technologies one fitted. Manifold prices are between £700 - £2000 depending on which one you buy.

Regards,

Neil

[Bazza]

In support of your post Derrick, my car has completely standard suspension and doesn't hang around - yours was the only car faster than me at the LMC Goodwood track day and even then only by a whisker :wink:

And before anyone starts talking about my 'vast' track experience, I am under no delusions of thinking that I am a seriously fast race driver!

[HOLZEREVO]

Derrick,

Re suspension...that was a general statement, which is, in general, true and is backed up by the experience of several others on the various forums, and various tuning magazines etc. Of course the drivers' expertise will have to be built into the equation, but if the same driver (be they average or good) each drove the two types of car described, in general they would be very surprised at how the car with the uprated suspension (done properly) performed.

Regards,

Neil

[HOLZEREVO]

ps what type of Alpina do you have, a mate of mine used to have the B10 Bi-Turbo, very, very quick on the straights but i used to kill him on the bends 8)

Jon,

Funnily enough, I have an Alpina B10 Bi-Turbo...and as an Autobahn cruiser (or slayer is more apt actually) it is virtually untouchable. I haven't had the opportunity of being up against a Lambo or the like, but it can remain glued (almost) to the rear bumper of any other exotica I have come up against (Porches, Ferraris, Astons etc), or (assuming I'm in front) they can't get close enough to pass...and no I'm not talking about an F40 here, rather your 'average' Ferrari (if there is such a thing).

I do not condone speeding. But as there is no legal speed limit on many sections of German autobahn, I have regularly seen 190 mph ;-)

Cheers,

Neil

[HuggyBear]

Derrick,

Of course the drivers' expertise will have to be built into the equation,

Neil

I'd agree but, Stelios and Kenny are both better drivers than me or Carlo. What i'm saying is you're wrong about horsepower being less effective than touring car spec suspension on an evo. As as this discussion is about road cars, you are even further off the mark. (IMO)

Derrick.

[Nasty Matt]

I am none too convinced on the suspension front simply because I don't drive to the cars cornering potential on the road. I want to add the FE springs, rear diff craddle and rear strut brace and I reckon that will all but irradicate understeer (or as much as is needed)

I say not convinced in terms of value for it for the road.

I like the idea of having better off boost performance as it tends to feel like you are not straining the engine to get better performance.

I'm not going to ask about prices for gas flowing etc yet as there a few other things I want to do to it first. But I would be interested in what sort of work would be beneficial.... and what sort of improvements I could get.

Getting off boost performance might not be everyones cup of tea but I drove a modified grale which felt like it had bags of torque. Secondly I am not a fan of running huge amounts of boost pressure just to get more power.

[HOLZEREVO]

In support of your post Derrick, my car has completely standard suspension and doesn't hang around - yours was the only car faster than me at the LMC Goodwood track day and even then only by a whisker :wink:

And before anyone starts talking about my 'vast' track experience, I am under no delusions of thinking that I am a seriously fast race driver!

Barry,

Are you saying then that your lap times (as this is the context you have insinuated ie on a track) would not get better were you to uprate the suspension on your car (everything else remaining the same)?

Are you also saying that with a totally standard car your lap times (ie with you driving, thus keeping all constants the same)) would be the same if compared with you driving a car with modified suspension, but an otherwise standard car; and also in comparison with you driving an otherwise standard car but with engine mods only.

My point was a general one, not necessarily related to Grales...it applies to all cars. Many 'experts' say that decent suspension (and I do not mean necessarily track suspension) will give significant and measurable gains in comparison with engine (power) mods (some even suggest it as the first mod to do). Basically the concept being that it is one thing to have a 400bhp engine for example, but it is quite another thing for that car to be able to put the power down properly on the road etc...suspension plays a large part in that too. This is where the addage of suspension vs power comes in...and I do emphasise, this is a general point...or are all those performance experts incorrect?

Regards,

Neil

[HOLZEREVO]

I'd agree but, Stelios and Kenny are both better drivers than me or Carlo. What i'm saying is you're wrong about horsepower being less effective than touring car spec suspension on an evo. As as this discussion is about road cars, you are even further off the mark. (IMO)

Derrick.

Derrick,

As I said previously my point was a general one, and indeed you do have a lot of experience, but I never mentioned touring car spec suspension, and the cars you have refered to are hardly typical and not your average 'modified' Grales either, they are fairly well modded in a number of departments.

Decent (and properly set up) suspension (road tuned) will also have measurable benefits.

James' comments for example (quoted below), in connection with my Group A 16V suspension he has fitted to his 8V (which has no engine mods) show that his car WITH the Gp A suspension is in contact with the road (ie on the road, not on the track) more often than with his original suspension set up. The implication here is that with standard suspension, but a higher powered car, the car might be leaving the road (ie airborne) more often than it did with a standard engine...which in general, isn't a good thing (not tested admitedly, as James hasn't got an uprated engine).

Again, in general, from James comments it seems that this is a very worthwhile upgrade on on otherwise standard car...for normal road driving.

==================================
"The eibach springs are progressive, making for just a slightly harder than standard ride over the small bumps and drain covers. Once loaded up they are much harder, but as soon as a wheel droops into a small dip for a microsecond, the suspension keeps it in contact with the tarmac. When the wheel comes back up the other side of the dip about a zillionth of a second later, it is so well damped that it stays on the ground, rather than flying upwards for a while as with std suspension.

I took the car down a favourite "C" road of mine, where I usually get air in two places. This time, I couldn't leave the ground at all - the dampers are so good at controlling the car's compressing and decompressing that it prevents the car from leaving the ground. The dampers react very quickly and with very good precision."
===============================

Regards,

Neil

[Bazza]

Neil,

Perhaps I should clarify my thoughts a little:-

1. I doubt that a £2k suspension package would improve lap times more than our £300 chip (fitted price + VAT).

2. I doubt that the same suspension package would improve lap times more than our £1350 F40 brake conversion (fitted price + VAT).

3. Of course a good suspension package will improve lap times but at the cost of a less comfortable ride and potential damage to the bodyshell.

Niether the brake or the chip conversions are likely to cause future grief!

My main point is that in value for money terms the suspension option looks pretty expensive.

[jacobyte]

This discussion is rather mixed to make any assumptions.

OK, we've decided that the driver must be constant.(And Derrick, you are very modest - I believe your driving capabilities are well up there with Carlo and Stelios, if not better that at least one of them!)

To a certain extent I agree with Barry - generally more power will get you better lap times, especially with the Integrale's excellent standard suspension and 4WD.

On a bumpy circuit, say Cadwell Park, a "medium" suspension upgrade may be better than a "medium" engine upgrade. On a smooth circuit, say Silverstone, it will most likely be the other way round.

But how can you quantify "medium"? £500? £1000? "proportional to one another"? Proportional in what way? It's so hard to quantify.

For £1000 you can get 280bhp or you can buy some pretty good suspension.

I guess there's only 1 way to find out. Let's put a standard Grale with Chip, Airbox + Exhaust on an "average" track, say Combe, and then another standard Grale with an equivalent suspension upgrade and see which is faster. I guarantee you the car with the good brakes will win!

[HuggyBear]

As I said previously my point was a general one...


Are you sure you're not getting your wires a little crossed Neil? :wink:



Matt,

Sorted suspension on an otherwise standard car, will run rings round a modified-engined car with suspension which hasn't been sorted.

Neil



James spoke of fitting uprated suspension on the same car. I only stated an experience which made me disagree with the above quote.

Derrick.

[HuggyBear]

(And Derrick, you are very modest - I believe your driving capabilities are well up there with Carlo and Stelios, if not better that at least one of them!)


I was taught by the master!

Is Cadwell as bumpy as Goodwood?

Derrick.

[Wallace]

Two penneth worth - (as I don't own a Delta !) but doesn't this all depend on a whole lot of variables - like is the track such that there's few bends, lotsa straights that would benefit a hight power engine or vica versa ??
And also what's the "weak" point of the car ? My standard Montecarlo certainly had more "handling" than performance, tweaking the engine on that certainly seemed to be the right way to go. But if you had a car with naff suspension in the first place then obviously "sorting" the suspension wolud be first choice.

[EvoStick]

Neil,

Matt stated he doesn't intend to track his car so expensive suspension is out....

Also I hit a series of pot holes down a straight narrow lane at night at 40mph (ish.. :-) ) and it wrecked 2 alloys and one on the outside rim!
I would hate to think what this would have done to my bodywork had I had rock hard suspension...

My 2p worth on modifications..... depending on budget...

on a budget...
new standard brakes... new fluid good fluid. ~£150 (maybe hoses yet to fit mine so can't comment)
decat bypass pipe remove precat brick. ~£100 + time...
a good chip (Bazza's is not expensive.)
poly suspension bushes ~£300

sky the limit
manifold 600-2000
ceramic roller turbo (impeller size determines lag vs. hp)
Evo2 size limit 270hp, Evo1 size 300, >Evo1 310+... as Hp > lag >...
exhaust... etc...
Chip..
bla bla bla...

If It was me with endless budget...
~900 Bazza's ceramic manifold
Ceramic titanium impeller Evo2 spec turbo £1400 surpose?
4" at turbo elbow... into 3" halfway then 2 1/2" the rest (to maintain low down torque) plus 270hp only available from Evo2 turbo..
Headflow and cams for low down torque...
charge cooler... straight run into turbo from a decent OEM Air cleaner of larger diameter..

I should imagine with this set up you could get the turbo spinning strongly from 2000rpm...

I have at present this which I imagine is peaking at 280-300hp...
Ceramic roller >Evo1 turbo ie 310+hp before surge limit (positive boost at 1500rpm but not strong until 3000rpm + maybe calibration/maybe lag??)
4">3" then 2 1/2 over axle then 3" again SS exhaust (pre-boost torque worse than my 60mm straight through... but just select a lower gear ?
Standard manifold...
Bazza's Evo2 chip.. not mapped for exhaust/different turbo though ..
slight modifications to the standard Air cleaner housing to reduce dirty side restriction... std system from cover onwards...
TASE ally dump valve to protect turbo..

Some time soon (read before I drive it again!) I need to fit new std brakes, braided hoses and change the fluid as they are starting to fade badly..

More like 7p but hey!

Good luck Matt with what you plan... I would aim for low down torque if I was doing it again...

John

[d9lta]

My 2p's worth
If your not taking it on track.
Take it to Prestocar,Bazza or someone you TRUST get the full car checked out.Get brakes stipped down and rebuild with new seals and pads,replace fluid with 5.1.Assuming the rest of the car is good and timing belts been changed,fit a Bazza chip,desent exaust minus cat and an induction kit and put proxes on it.
Their is a good chip from Prestocar but it runs 1.5 bar boost your turbo can only handle 1.2.To change the turbo is £600 fitted.
It's my opinion but leave the std suspension it's great unless your doing a lot of trackday stuff.Every lowered and uprated suspension car i've driven is ok for a while but wet handling and krap ride start to get on your tits.The roads near me are rough to say the least if your local roads are good you might disagree.
Hope this of some help
Cheers
Scott

[HOLZEREVO]

I only stated an experience which made me disagree with the above quote.

Derrick.

[HOLZEREVO]

I only stated an experience which made me disagree with the above quote.

Derrick.

Derrick,

Nothing wrong in that. Your experience in the 'general run of things' though across all cars (which is really where I was coming from) is an exception (IMHO)

There will always be examples which don't fit the mould, so to speak.

Neil

[base5]

...but currently have the Racing Technologies one fitted.
Do you happen to have a picture yet..??

;)

Base

[Nasty Matt]

Charge cooler... anyone got a link to some details about them? What Lotus has the charge cooler recommended for a grale?

I couldn't find anything on Evocars website.

[HFStuart]

While on this subject is there any reason why a chargecooler circuit should use water as the cooling medium ?

Could you not use a thermal fluid and have it even more effective ?

Stuart

[Bazza]

Charge cooler... anyone got a link to some details about them? What Lotus has the charge cooler recommended for a grale?

I couldn't find anything on Evocars website.

It's off the Lotus Esprit 300.

[Bazza]

While on this subject is there any reason why a chargecooler circuit should use water as the cooling medium ?

Could you not use a thermal fluid and have it even more effective ?

Stuart

It may be worth adding 'water wetter' to the coolant but you will not find any liquid more efficient than pure water as a coolant.

[Wallace]

I think liquid sodium (as used in the odd nuke reactor) is better.




But not so user friendly.

[HOLZEREVO]

Charge cooler... anyone got a link to some details about them? What Lotus has the charge cooler recommended for a grale?

I couldn't find anything on Evocars website.

Matt,

You must have a short memory...it is all in the FAQ on Delphi.

Neil

[HOLZEREVO]

I think liquid sodium (as used in the odd nuke reactor) is better.




But not so user friendly.

Wallace,

Sodium would be absolutely useless in a chargecooler...it would be just a solid block of metal most of the time and wouldn't cool at all. Melting point is 97.72 degrees C; boiling point 883 degrees C ;-)

Neil

[HOLZEREVO]

...but currently have the Racing Technologies one fitted.
Do you happen to have a picture yet..??

;)

Base

Yes, but not with me.

You will see it at the Alternative IDM anyway.

Neil

[Nasty Matt]

Matt,

You must have a short memory...it is all in the FAQ on Delphi.

Neil

Unfortunately I can not access Delphi from work. I will have a little read over the weekend from home.

[HFStuart]

I was thinking more of aircon / refrigeration coolants.

[Bazza]

I was thinking more of aircon / refrigeration coolants.

But then you would need an aircon pump and another condensor :roll:

[Ace]

James

I'm very surprised that no one has mentioned tuition as a worthwhile "modification". It's all well and good having 300bhp+, but given that you regularly dish out a good spanking to these modified cars in your 8v, it shows that the driver is still the most important part of the equation.

Derek

[TerraFox]

I agree with Derek, that the driver is very important,

I once streetraced a Honda Civic CRX V-Tec and I was glued on his tail till around 120 km/h(around 75 mph)

The thing here is i was driving a Suzuki Swift 1,3 l !!!



Regards
Raouf A :twisted:

[HOLZEREVO]

James
it shows that the driver is still the most important part of the equation.

Derek

Indeed Derek. I also referred to driver skill/experience earlier in the thread.

Neil

[TerraFox]

Another good example of the driver being important:


Chrysler/Dodge Viper:

V-10, 7990 cc
550 hp@6000
Six Speed Transmission
Top speed: 301 kph(187 mph)
0-60 mph: 4.4 secs
0-100 mph: 9.7 secs
Rearwheel Drive


-----

This Is One powerfull car an proven both fast and rewarding, when the driver knows what he is doing, if not, its dynamite on wheels 8)

http://www.geocities.com/epoludo/Viper.jpg

[TerraFox]

Dodge Viper Venom 660


http://www.geocities.com/epoludo/Dodge_Viper_Venom_660.jpg

[TerraFox]

what is this?

http://www.cadserver.co.uk/archive/2000/Aug/11/lister2.jpg

[jacobyte]

James

I'm very surprised that no one has mentioned tuition as a worthwhile "modification". It's all well and good having 300bhp+, but given that you regularly dish out a good spanking to these modified cars in your 8v, it shows that the driver is still the most important part of the equation.

Derek

Derek

You're right - driver ability is the best investment anyone can make. However, this was purely comparing suspension mods v engine mods. My post referred to a constant driver testing the two options. £1000 will buy you many more seconds per lap as an improved driver than any suspension or engine modsd for that money.

James

[HOLZEREVO]

£1000 will buy you many more seconds per lap as an improved driver than any suspension or engine modsd for that money.

James

James,

...until the gearbox jams in gear...and then the driver will tend to lose several seconds per lap or 10s of minutes whilst the pit crew take it to bits ;-)

...just generalising of course ;-)

Cheers,

Neil

[TerraFox]

can anyone tell me if the see the pictures of the viper(s)?

i dont on my comp...

Thanks,

Raouf A. 8O

[HOLZEREVO]

can anyone tell me if the see the pictures of the viper(s)?8O

Yes Raouf, the images are there.

Neil

[HOLZEREVO]

what is this?

http://www.cadserver.co.uk/archive/2000/Aug/11/lister2.jpg

Raouf,

Believe it or not...it is a Lister (as the URL suggests?) ;-)

Read the whole article here and you will become enlightened:

http://www.cadserver.co.uk/common/viewer/archive/2000/Aug/11/feature7.phtm

Lister, a great British company racing a great British car - the Lister Storm.

Regards,

Neil

[TerraFox]

Neil,

I know lister (great succes in Le mans ect.) :twisted:

I probably did not make my question clear :roll: , so ill rephrase it.

The picture features a Lister rim, why does it have those nice colours...

Thanks

Raouf A.

[TerraFox]

Sweet paint & chrome


http://www.auto-extreme.com/eng/gallery/getpic.php?id=12313

[crono33]

sounds like the pefect brake fluid then hehehhe


I think liquid sodium (as used in the odd nuke reactor) is better.




But not so user friendly.

Wallace,

Sodium would be absolutely useless in a chargecooler...it would be just a solid block of metal most of the time and wouldn't cool at all. Melting point is 97.72 degrees C; boiling point 883 degrees C ;-)

Neil

[evokat]

I used to work in Leatherhead in a trading estate a few years back, Lister being our neighbour. When they started the cars up they used to get a BIG audience. Some of the Jaguars they had there with a touch of Lister were awesome. Some of the jags had Saudi plates. They used to ship all the way from Saudi to have the work done. A modded Jaguar? I know, I know.
The Lister garage being a neighbour was the only perk in my job.
Does anybody know if they are still there?

[base5]

sounds like the pefect brake fluid then hehehhe
Once melted it is, but before that... 8O

Base

PS. It's an ideal medium to keep the engine hot. There are systems available that use this method.

[Nasty Matt]

Well just to update everyone on "mods" I have had my fe springs, rear strut brace and diff cradle added.

Ok I am new tyres (as I have fitted 17 inch wheels) but I think those mods are well worth the money. I have not had any understeer as yet, ride is firmer but not too firm - more it feels like the suspension and handling are "tight" (if that makes sense). Obviously I had all the stuff fitted at once so I can't say individually which was best.

Next I will be chipping and de-cating very soon. I will post my opinion on that as soon as it is done. After that... well that's where I will need inspiration.

[Nasty Matt]

Well decatting and chipping is happening in a couple of weeks time and then....................

Charge cooler and water spray kit.

The more I think about the charge cooler the more I like the idea. It shouldn't put any more strain on the engine more likely keep the performance at an even level. Outside temperature should have little effect.

Of course I will post my findings.

After that? I may put in a full 3inch exhaust system or a new manifold. But the cooler probably won't go in until Oct/Nov so exhaust/manifold next year.

8)

[J8N HF]

Just my twopenneth Matt, but I would consider doing the manifold and exh before the chipping... this way the chip can take full advantage of a nice free flowing system... Mmmm lots of horses, anyway I know of a stainless exhaust maker who's done a nice job on a few evo's, (mine is pending) with a whole stainless 3" system for £600ish, not including the manifold, and rumour has it that they were the original suppliers for bazza's system... they're in the south east, email me for the details if required...
cheers
Jon

[HOLZEREVO]

Jon,

"and rumour has it that they were the original suppliers for bazza's system"

Do you mean 'Hayward and Scott'?

Neil

[J8N HF]

Thts them... however they can be a bit cheeky when it comes to their prices so i dont like plugging 'em too much
Jon

[Nasty Matt]

well I am going to update this thread as to my latest "mods".. for all of those of you that don't read the evoforum or don't care here it is..

Prestocar chip and decat (pre cat removed and centre section is straight through a la Supersprint)

Do I get technical and explain what the chip does? Probabaly best not because if I get one tiny bit wrong everyone will take it as gospel.


This was worth the money (about £500 all in all) It now feels considerably quicker. It's an evo 2 and I was a little bit disappointed with the feel of the turbo kick coming from a 16v. But now I get a decent kick and it pulls better above 4500rpm where it used to die right off.

Idles cleanly, starts nicely and is fine to drive off boost. I am driving on the motorway tonight so it will be nice to see what it's like if I get stuck in traffic, my standard car used to hate dribbling along.

I have kept the standard back box as I think they look nice and the sound hasn't changed at all (decatting it)

Next? Charge cooler and spray kit. Then.. probably bigger turbo as I have heard running higher boost will probably lessen the life of the small turbo anyways and I quite fancy the big turbo surge again!!